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Chris Hobson

Way solar systems are marketed

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A Facebook page has come to my notice that markets a solar system with a 1.5kW array as a 7.5kWh system and a 4.5kW system as a 22.5 kWh system. I think that is just plain disingenuous. It appears the inverter used is an Axpert. Now I like an Axpert but for the system to run properly there is the issue of floating the batteries. If I had the money I would challenge the cost of one of their systems to demonstrate that they could even average their stated "systerm size" and fully charge their batteries, allowing for 2-3 hours of float charging.

Am I being unreasonable saying they should not be quoting kWh as a system size as their figures are based on theoretical production?

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New luxury car, from only R13199 (it always ends on 99). The trick is in the "from" keyword, or sometimes "up to", or "your share of", in other words if you put down a 20% deposit, take a 35% residual value, and finance the rest over 72 months... yeah sure... then it will by only 13.2k a month... :-)

In this case, no clear keyword, so definitely a little sneakier than usual. I would be amazed if that 7.5kwh system even gets close to 5. I have 1.5kwp on my roof, I made almost 8.4kwh on one particular day but the truth is that it only really makes above 7kwh two months of the year. Right now I do around 5.8kwh on a sunny day. And that's with a hybrid inverter that can grid-tie :-)

On the other side of the coin, when marketing to the average home user: they generally have no idea what 4.5kwp even means, but a slightly larger fraction of them do know what 20kwh means. It does also use a 5-hour peak solar day in the calculation which technically isn't wrong. So I'm really not quite sure, I suppose if they disclosed those things before sale I would be okay with it.

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As @plonkster stated , the average person , and I will include myself in that group just before I started my system , don't have a clue as to what a baseload is what his day and night consumption is or even what his peak usage is. They mostly believe that , if you change all your light to LED's then you are saving energy. Even if the LED and the energy savers both use 10 w :) . But they still keep the fluorescent light , that uses 60w , on the whole night  because someone at some stage said that fluorescents use less energy than any other light. O ja and don't forget the good old desktop pc that bugger can rip you a extra 300w just on idle if you are not careful. So whether they say 4 , 5 8 or even 10 would not make much difference BUT I would look at the price they sell the system , if they fall within a reasonable profit margin then I would be okish with it but sometimes these okes charge an easy 150% profit margin and then I start to lift the eyebrows. 

Interesting thing I red over the weekend , SA is currently using less energy than in 2007 when all this load shedding started! I for one maintain that the Zuptas had a scheme to put SA under pressure to push MUCH more money towards Eskom unfortunately the residents of SA is much more resilient and adapted or should I say luckily....

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29 minutes ago, PaulF007 said:

had a scheme to put SA under pressure to push MUCH more money towards Eskom unfortunately the residents of SA is much more resilient and adapted or should I say luckily

They had a plan alright, but they pulled it at the worst possible time. They couldn't have known, bless their souls, but all this nonsense started around 2007/2008(ish) as JZ became president of the ANC and all those corruption charges and shower-gate strangely got swept under the carpet. Incidentally, 2008 was also the year the Americans pulled operation sub-prime, and then came the big one... in 2012 PV panels dropped by half, even in 2015 it shed another 10%, and just this year we've seen it drop to below ZAR5/Wp despite our poor exchange rate. I speak under correction, but costs now must be less than 20% of what it was in 2008.

These guys single-handedly started the small-scale renewable energy sector in this country, and the guys who are worst hit remains the poor.

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On 7/24/2017 at 9:00 AM, PaulF007 said:

As @plonkster stated , the average person , and I will include myself in that group just before I started my system , don't have a clue as to what a baseload is what his day and night consumption is or even what his peak usage is. They mostly believe that , if you change all your light to LED's then you are saving energy. Even if the LED and the energy savers both use 10 w :) . But they still keep the fluorescent light , that uses 60w , on the whole night  because someone at some stage said that fluorescents use less energy than any other light. O ja and don't forget the good old desktop pc that bugger can rip you a extra 300w just on idle if you are not careful. So whether they say 4 , 5 8 or even 10 would not make much difference BUT I would look at the price they sell the system , if they fall within a reasonable profit margin then I would be okish with it but sometimes these okes charge an easy 150% profit margin and then I start to lift the eyebrows. 

Interesting thing I red over the weekend , SA is currently using less energy than in 2007 when all this load shedding started! I for one maintain that the Zuptas had a scheme to put SA under pressure to push MUCH more money towards Eskom unfortunately the residents of SA is much more resilient and adapted or should I say luckily....

Here's something interesting. I brought home some rackmount servers to setup a cloud cluster. 4 servers and a switch and just as I switched them on this evening, I thought I'd check what the damage will be on my batteries / electricity bill. The 4 server cluster doesn't draw much power, about 300W in total. It's not doing much, yet. 

 

@Chris Hobson perhaps part of the marketing technique relies on the fact that most people read their electricity bill in kWh?

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On 28/07/2017 at 10:27 PM, SilverNodashi said:

 

@Chris Hobson perhaps part of the marketing technique relies on the fact that most people read their electricity bill in kWh?

I am perhaps just a grumpy old git but if one wants to quote kWh then at least have the quoted production not from the realm of fantasy. Plonky and I have exchange several FB pages where the production is just too good to be true.

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