Axpert and Hubble RS232 ports

[SchalkB]

First time posting, so hope this is the correct spot...

I have a question regarding interfacing a Voltronic (VOLTEX rebrand) Axpert 5kva inverter and Hubble 4,8kW lithium battery. Both units have RS232 ports, but no other points of commonality.

I would prefer not to rely on voltage measuring alone from the inverter for SOC of the battery, so direct interface would be ideal. But as the battery seems to be relatively new on the market, I can not find much info in this. (For example Pylontech has the handy ICC Raspberry pie device)

Would it be a safe bet to say that, if both devices have clearly marked ports as RS232, they would be able to communicate using this interface?

Thanks

[Coulomb]

On 2020/02/12 at 3:17 AM, SchalkB said:

Would it be a safe bet to say that, if both devices have clearly marked ports as RS232, they would be able to communicate using this interface?

No. The Axpert models that can talk to  PylonTechs, presumably Voltex included, talk to PylonTech batteries (and only that brand [ edit: not any more ]) over RS-485, not the RS-232 port. Many Axpert models lack the ability to talk to the PylonTechs at all. The Kings seem to be the most advanced, but even they seem to struggle, especially when there are more than one King in parallel.

It might be possible to cook up a small computer to translate between the Voltex and the Hubble, but unless you are really keen and have lots of time and enthusiasm, and can find good details on the protocol, they won't be able to talk directly.

About the best you could do would be to use ICC on a Pi, and use a Victron BMV to monitor the battery current and estimate SOC a whole lot better than the Voltex will.

Edited January 19, 2021 by Coulomb

[HubbleLithium]

Hi SchalkB,

The Hubble has full integration with Axpert VMIII and King 5KVA models through the new Voltronic Protocol.

You will require SBU firmware 02.49 to enable the "lib" Lithium battery function under setting 5. 

You will also require Main CPU version 71.92. This fixes the problem where the rectifier wont drop out when the battery reaches 100% with notice 69.

SImply plug in the Hubble through RS485-A to the BMS port and it will take up to 120 seconds to sync. Once it has synced the battery icon will flash.

If you have an existing battery then you will need to bring it in to one of our service centres so that we can flash the new protocol on the Hubble.

 

[Coulomb]

19 hours ago, HubbleLithium said:

You will also require Main CPU version 71.92.

That sounds like a King firmware version number; presumably the Axpert VM III requires a different firmware version. Do you happen to know the version number required for that model?

Are these updated firmwares available for download?

Or do you have to have a really recent machine?

Or can they be requested from your supplier?

[HubbleLithium]

2 hours ago, Coulomb said:

That sounds like a King firmware version number; presumably the Axpert VM III requires a different firmware version. Do you happen to know the version number required for that model?

Are these updated firmwares available for download?

Or do you have to have a really recent machine?

Or can they be requested from your supplier?

Hi Coulomb,

The MCU for the KING and the VMIII is the same firmware. You can use the same on either.

The Main CPU firmware is specific to the King or VM.

The oldest MCU upgrade we have done is from MCU 02.40 to 02.49.

I do have the firmwares. Please check your PM.

[IronEYE]

 

On 2020/06/24 at 10:44 AM, HubbleLithium said:

Hi SchalkB,

The Hubble has full integration with Axpert VMIII and King 5KVA models through the new Voltronic Protocol.

You will require SBU firmware 02.49 to enable the "lib" Lithium battery function under setting 5. 

You will also require Main CPU version 71.92. This fixes the problem where the rectifier wont drop out when the battery reaches 100% with notice 69.

SImply plug in the Hubble through RS485-A to the BMS port and it will take up to 120 seconds to sync. Once it has synced the battery icon will flash.

If you have an existing battery then you will need to bring it in to one of our service centres so that we can flash the new protocol on the Hubble.

 

I recently got a Hubble and I have a RCT Axpert King with the latest firmware (71.92 and 02.49), but when I use the short patch cable that came with the Hubble (standard T-568B pinout) I get 61 communication error. I could only find the below picture of a Pylontech pinout on the forum and it looks like pin 5 on the King is RS485-A, but I'm not sure if this will work on the Hubble as well? Can you please confirm the correct cable configuration?

[HubbleLithium]

Hi Ironeye,

The patch cable is for interlinking more batteries. You need to make up a cable for the Axpert.

Cable should be pin 1 to pin 3 and pin 2 to pin 5.

Pin 1 and 2 side goes into the Hubble.

Make sure you give the Hubble an address so the inverter can recognise the pack. If you only have 1 battery then set pin 1 up rest down to make it the master.

All the best

 

[Flipster]

Hi, do I understand this correctly, the battery does not need a firmware update only the inverter (I have a Kadak VMIII), IF it is older than firmware ver: SBU firmware 02.49?

 

Or can I download the latest firmware and flash the battery myself? Which firmware should the battery have so the the BMS will work as described above in this thread?

 

Edited October 6, 2020 by Flipster

[HubbleLithium]

Hi Flipster,

 

Yes only the Axpert only needs the update. The battery is ready with the software alread on it.

[AndrewLamb]

Good morning, I have a 1 year old Synerji 5kv48 inverter and am about to buy the Hubble battery. How do I check what firmware version is I stay on my inverter and how do I upgrade to the required firmware version so that it is fully compatible with the Hubble? Thank you for taking the time to assist a solar rookie. 

[HubbleLithium]

Hi Andrew,

I presume it's a MKS model. There is no software update required on these as they do not have a modbus port to integrate like the King, Max and VM3 models.

You can set the settings manually on USER and then the battery will work. Program 29 cutoff should be set to 46V. If you require full integration then you can install a ICC raspbery pi with the Hubble ICC software on it. You then get full monitoring, integration and communication. Checkout www.iccsoftware.co.za if you require full communication.

 

[AndrewLamb]

Thank you for the prompt reply. Can you recommend a specialist that can set up the ICC option as you have recommended as I don’t have the knowledge to do this myself. 

[HubbleLithium]

Hi Andrew,

 

You can email [email protected] and they can assist in the sale of the software or compelete unit and they will assist with the setup for you.

[Dirkie]

I have 3x axpert kings in parallel with 4x 3.5 pylontech batteries the master axpert king is connected to the pylontetech batteries and it is working fine with out any errors but the two slave axpert kings keeps giving me the error 61 should they ten also be connected to the batteries with the com cable

[Lewis]

On 2020/09/20 at 1:14 PM, HubbleLithium said:

Hi Ironeye,

The patch cable is for interlinking more batteries. You need to make up a cable for the Axpert.

Cable should be pin 1 to pin 3 and pin 2 to pin 5.

Pin 1 and 2 side goes into the Hubble.

Make sure you give the Hubble an address so the inverter can recognise the pack. If you only have 1 battery then set pin 1 up rest down to make it the master.

All the best

 

Evening. Please explain how to interlink and address 2 batteries. Do i use a or b ports of rs485 ports. Also once connected good do i get the batteries to sync up?

 

 

[HubbleLithium]

Hi Lewis,

 

Master battery:
PIN 1 - ON
PIN 2 - OFF
PIN 3 - OFF
PIN 4 - OFF

Slave A:
PIN 1 - OFF
PIN 2 - ON
PIN 3 - OFF
PIN 4 - OFF

 

Use a normal cat5 / computer network cable and connect the right side RS485 (2x RS485 ports together) to the next battery pack. The CAN will double up on th AH charge/discharge and your battery AH will double up.

[Connect Systems]

Your reply above :

Master battery:
PIN 1 - ON
PIN 2 - OFF
PIN 3 - OFF
PIN 4 - OFF

Slave A:
PIN 1 - OFF
PIN 2 - ON
PIN 3 - OFF
PIN 4 - OFF

 

Use a normal cat5 / computer network cable and connect the right side RS485 (2x RS485 ports together) to the next battery pack. The CAN will double up on th AH charge/discharge and your battery AH will double up.

Question:

Does this apply to the Hubble batteries X2 on a Victron inverter as well.

 

[HubbleLithium]

Hi Connect Systems,

Yes. Victron will change the CCL & DCL to 200Amp when 2 batteries are connected. For every extra battery the CCL & DCL will increase by 100Amp.

If you want to run the advanced Victron Extended Protocol Canbus and get advanced parameters, battery temperature and cell voltages from the battery then you can install a RIOT between the master battery and the Victron GX.

The RIOT protocol encapsulates the Victron Extended Protocol. It is one of the 5 CANbus protocols that make up the complete RIOT Protocol.

Below is a RIOT connected with a AM-2 and a Venus GX. You can see the extra details that Victron provides.

[Coulomb]

@HubbleLithium,

It seems to me that the LIb protocol has been dropped in removable display (MCU) firmware version 02.62.

Does this mean that Hubble batteries can no longer connect to Axperts, except via ICC?

Or is this a temporary firmware glitch, to be fixed with later MCU firmware?

Do you recommend connecting to Axperts via ICC?

I'm trying to decide whether to patch MCU firmware version 02.61, 02.62, or wait longer for the firmware versions to settle. It's a lot of work, so I'd really rather only do it once, and not have a soon-obsoleted version patched.

[HubbleLithium]

Hi Coulomb,

 

We dropped the LIB protocol as Axpert decided to drop the LIB protocol. From what we understand they are looking at CANbus. We are not sure when or if they will impliment CAN bus. However you can see on the Axpert MAX documentaiton they mention CANbus, but its not active yet.

We decided to only support CAN bus ourselfes as modbus is too unstable. All our models now have CANbus and works with any CANbus inverter.

The ICC still works with Hubble for Axpert. 

[Leon Jbay]

Hallo what cable connect between the am2 and the raspberry pi?

[Leon Jbay]

On 2021/04/06 at 1:03 PM, HubbleLithium said:

Hi Coulomb,

 

We dropped the LIB protocol as Axpert decided to drop the LIB protocol. From what we understand they are looking at CANbus. We are not sure when or if they will impliment CAN bus. However you can see on the Axpert MAX documentaiton they mention CANbus, but its not active yet.

We decided to only support CAN bus ourselfes as modbus is too unstable. All our models now have CANbus and works with any CANbus inverter.

The ICC still works with Hubble for Axpert. 

Hi how do you get the hubbleam2 to communicate with the pi icc?

[David FC]

On 2021/04/06 at 1:03 PM, HubbleLithium said:

Hi Coulomb,

 

We dropped the LIB protocol as Axpert decided to drop the LIB protocol. From what we understand they are looking at CANbus. We are not sure when or if they will impliment CAN bus. However you can see on the Axpert MAX documentaiton they mention CANbus, but its not active yet.

We decided to only support CAN bus ourselfes as modbus is too unstable. All our models now have CANbus and works with any CANbus inverter.

The ICC still works with Hubble for Axpert. 

Hi, 2 questions re Axpert Max 7.2 (firmware version 45.04) with 2 x X-100s

1. Do you know if there is updated Axpert Max firmware that now supports can bus i.e. can talk to the x-100s? If so, can I then use a standard RJ45 cable or do I still need to switch pins 1 to 3 and 2 to 5?
2. If the above is not resolved I am looking at the Hubble RIOT, specifically with the Axpert Max and RIOT would I still leave the inverter on "USE" and have manual settings?

PS my Axpert Max has the "LIB" option so I made up the specified cable but no luck, it does not communicate with my X-100s.

[EPH]

Greetings All 

 

Where can I get a BMS cable for the new Hubble 5.5 AM series and the SMH (previously ICC) raspberry PI?

 

Kind Regards

Sean

[Zimnismoboy34]

On 2021/04/06 at 1:03 PM, HubbleLithium said:

Hi Coulomb,

 

We dropped the LIB protocol as Axpert decided to drop the LIB protocol. From what we understand they are looking at CANbus. We are not sure when or if they will impliment CAN bus. However you can see on the Axpert MAX documentaiton they mention CANbus, but its not active yet.

We decided to only support CAN bus ourselfes as modbus is too unstable. All our models now have CANbus and works with any CANbus inverter.

The ICC still works with Hubble for Axpert. 

I think this information is rather misleading . Voltronic have not dropped the Lib protocol and their latest communication states that its still in use . The latest firmware version reflects that the Lib protocol is still present in the Menu on the Axpert King .