10 hours ago, plonkster said:

To put it really simple terms: There is a requirement in SANS that says you cannot connect a battery to the mix unless you first isolate the grid. That made sense 30 years ago, but modern hybrids do this thing that we can essentially call "peak shaving", where battery power is used to supplement grid power, and you can't do that if there is a hard grid-vs-battery switch requirement.

This means all the Hybrids on the market are technically not SANS compliant. SANS will have to change. The question is whether CoCT will help us with that.

Are you saying the changeover needs to go between the grid and inverter input?

I normally put it between the inverter output and load, so that you can choose to run the load off the inverter, or eskom, in-case of maintenance or emergency. But then the Inverter still has a freed from Eskom with a double pole isolator. 

3 minutes ago, SilverNodashi said:

Are you saying the changeover needs to go between the grid and inverter input?

That's how I understood it. Take a look at the typical diagram of a Multi:

The backfeed relay is marked with a red number 1. When the inverter is running grid-parallel, that relay is closed. The inverter component (black box with the = and the ~ signs) is on and moving energy either into or out of the battery. So if you put a changeover on the output side, while it is extremely handy, the battery is technically connected even though we haven't islanded yet.

If the grid fails, the backfeed relay is opened. The battery remains connected, the inverter remains on, the loads on the output remains up.

There is one difference not illustrated here. The NRS-approved inverters have two relays in series and two redundant control circuits and they disconnect the grid as required to form an island. Now the entire time we were discussing this, I thought this method of islanding was against SANS, and that SANS would have to be amended to accommodate it.

But if it will sign off as is... I'm not rocking no boats 🙂

2 minutes ago, plonkster said:

That's how I understood it. Take a look at the typical diagram of a Multi:

The backfeed relay is marked with a red number 1. When the inverter is running grid-parallel, that relay is closed. The inverter component (black box with the = and the ~ signs) is on and moving energy either into or out of the battery. So if you put a changeover on the output side, while it is extremely handy, the battery is technically connected even though we haven't islanded yet.

If the grid fails, the backfeed relay is opened. The battery remains connected, the inverter remains on, the loads on the output remains up.

There is one difference not illustrated here. The NRS-approved inverters have two relays in series and two redundant control circuits and they disconnect the grid as required to form an island. Now the entire time we were discussing this, I thought this method of islanding was against SANS, and that SANS would have to be amended to accommodate it.

But if it will sign off as is... I'm not rocking no boats 🙂

That part confuse me a bit as well since the current SANS regulations (I don't have it with me, can't quote verbatim) state that we need to put a changeover inbetween the load (i.e. house / building / etc) and the secondary feed, be it a generator, UPS or inverter. And we've been signing up COC's based on that. 

So, and I have asked this before, does the anti-island device not suffice, legally / according to CoCT for the feedback relay or do they insist on a manual changover at that point?

The main problem I see with installing the manual changover is that somone then has to manually change it over when there's load shedding. Or do I misread this part?

6 minutes ago, plonkster said:

But if it will sign off as is... I'm not rocking no boats 🙂

Did you feel that "WHOOOOSH" barely missing your head? 🙈🙉🙊

On a more serious note, what is bothering you and Phil?

23 minutes ago, The Terrible Triplett said:

On a more serious note, what is bothering you and Phil?

Naaah I'm good. Ignorance is bliss.

2 minutes ago, plonkster said:

Naaah I'm good. Ignorance is bliss.

I accept.