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Saul

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  1. I'm not familiar with that view so it's hard to comment - but the calculation would suggest an implied capacity of 4.2kwH, which is not great, but makes me suspicious of those numbers given the earlier numbers you supplied looked much better. If you can supply the same table as you did in your original post (but over a longer period), we should be able to get a clearer picture.
  2. Best to measure it over a longer period -and a bigger SOC change - small decimals can have a big impact, especially with smaller numbers. Looking at your numbers if you measure from 63% SOC to 51%, that's a 12% change for 0.6kwH. This converts to an effective capacity of 5kwH (1/.12 * 0.6), which is what I saw on mine and am still seeing 6 months later. So looks OK, but as mentioned, best to test it over a longer period.
  3. Thanks for sharing @Boerseun. Since my one battery was replaced, my readings have been consistently at about 91%, which is equivalent to the 10000Wh you were originally getting. This is on discharging - when charging the implied capacity is pretty much at the expected 11kwH. This is perhaps consistent with your experience - perhaps you are still getting less on discharging? Or maybe the higher than 11kwH on charging you are getting is consistent with 11kwH on discharge. I'd be interested in knowing this. As mentioned before, I would have previously written this off as efficiency loss - about 10% ,except for the fact that others with the same inverter were getting the full capacity on discharge (both with Hubbles and other batteries). But I accept your point that there may be other factors which can affect this number. Overall, I am very happy with my installation - I can live with what may be slight underperformance or a less than optimal setup - I will just watch the battery performance closely to see if it deteriorates (or improves)!
  4. @HubbleLithium Thanks for the reply. As mentioned before, I am using the inverter to measure - the Sunsynk has fields which show "Battery in" and "Battery out" in kwH which effectively capture kwH used for charging/discharging. I do not know whether, for example, the "Battery out" measures the kwH before or after conversion to AC and would have been happy to write off the lower than expected kwH reading as a loss through inefficiency of conversion. However, other members of the forum, both those using Hubbles and those using other brands (all with the same inverter), have shown readings at 100% and even above (compared to mine of about 90-92%), which suggests that the value the inverter shows is before any efficiency loss. The most likely explanation to me is that my batteries are still underperforming slightly, which is mildly disappointing for brand new batteries. Whilst I appreciate the RIOT may be more accurate, I do not think it is reasonable to purchase it just to check this especially as I am able to compare using the same method with other forum members.
  5. Update: I have monitored my system over the past few days with the replaced battery and I am still getting about 1kwH per 10% sometimes fractionally more. So I'd say about 92% of label capacity. This is mildly disappointing but probably only because other members have shown better performance with both their Hubbles and other brands. Prior to knowing that, I would have written it off as efficiency losses or Sunsynk measuring inaccuracy. If there are other Hubble owners out there getting similar performance, please let me know! I'm not going to lose any sleep about it though but will watch it to see that it doesn't deteriorate (or at least, not quickly). Of course, if anyone at @HubbleLithiumhas any thoughts/comments on this, I would appreciate hearing them. In terms of the overall post sales service from Hubble - I would probably say that it was on average positive. I never dealt with them directly, but their willingness to replace the faulty battery entirely was appreciated. There was a delay in the process as mentioned before, which was not great, but I am willing to accept that there were mitigating circumstances. I have not had any experience with other solar-related brands so I cannot compare Hubble to them.
  6. @Brani @ThatGuy So, my new battery was ready on Tuesday as promised. My installer could only collect and install today. He told me when he arrived that Hubble had confirmed that the old faulty battery apparently had an inactive cell, which is why they replaced it. So, a definite positive there as they provided an entirely new battery - only downside was the time to replace - as mentioned before, I have some sympathy given current circumstances, but felt the communication could have been better. Of course, the faulty cell is also slightly concerning, but apparently this is very rare. As it was only installed today, I have had limited time to assess new performance. However, on limited data (using the method I described before), the 2 batteries I have look like they are performing at about 1kwH per 10%. This is better but still at only about 91% of expected performance, main caveat being the limited time to assess performance and reduce the effects of rounding. I will monitor this more closely over the next few days to get a better handle on it and report back.
  7. Hi @ThatGuy I was hoping to be further down the resolution path before providing feedback. This is where I stand at the moment (please note that all communication with Hubble has been done by my installer): - Hubble agreed to swap out the battery that they initially thought might just be the BMS. This is obviously a positive. However, they said the new battery should be ready early last week, but then on Wednesday said it had been delayed until early this week (but based on other threads I've seen, this seems optimistic). They did not confirm what the problem was with the initial battery. - I will hopefully be in a position by the end of this week to provide feedback on the new battery performance (providing I have it reinstalled in the next day or two - which as mentioned, seems unlikely now). - My existing battery continues to run at about 88% of expected capacity. I have asked my installer to convey this to Hubble but I'm not sure how strongly he has made this point to them. Once the new battery has been installed, we will see if this affects the existing battery (I'm not sure if the BMS has been affected by the old misbehaving battery). I know @HubbleLithium check this forum from time to time, so I've included them on this response so that they are aware that I have a concern (as do others) that their batteries are running below the expected capacity. So, my battery was returned to Hubble on 21 April, which means I have been without an item I paid around R25k for, for almost a month. I have moved from mildly annoyed to annoyed. Needing to tiptoe around my limited battery capacity with the new bout of loadshedding has not made me happier. As I mentioned before, I can accept that problems arise with any product, and even that there are issues around global supply of components, but the lack of clear communication and expectations management is disappointing. I will provide further feedback when appropriate.
  8. Thanks for all the thoughts and opinions. @Chloe - I first noticed something about 2 or 3 days after installation, The 2 batteries were performing at about 70% of expected capacity. I informed my installer and in consultation with Hubble, he tried to balance the 2 batteries but concluded that the one battery was faulty and hence returned it. This is the one that they say might be the BMS - I will get some feedback tomorrow hopefully and let you all know how it goes. Since that one was removed, my remaining battery is running at about 86%-90% of expected capacity. One of the reasons I started the post was to try gauge what performance other guys were getting as this was obviously low but I was unsure of how accurate the Sunsynk/Solarman measure was. I wanted to make sure that when my other battery was re-installed I knew what was reasonable to expect. @Achmat, @Tariq (with Pylontechs) are getting pretty much 100%, @Kill_switchis getting above 100% with same setup as me and @leshen has indicated that he is also getting 100% on his AM2 installations (although measured with RIOT - I don't know if he has checked this on the Sunsynk or Solarman). @ThatGuyhas indicated that he is aware of a test unit that has underperformed. So, as it stands, it appears that my remaining battery is also underperforming, although not as dramatically as the 2 combined. I'm also not sure how the BMS of the remaining battery might have been affected after the other battery was removed but from the feedback so far, there does not appear to be any reason why I should not expect 100% on both batteries. I would expect this to become less over time, but certainly not on a new battery. I have no issue with Hubble - all products can have faults at some stage, but it is how these are resolved that is important. If Hubble are able to resolve the issues with both batteries I will happily let you know and vice versa.
  9. Thanks. Useful to know - which leads me to conclude that either the Sunsynk/Solarman information is VERY inaccurate (although it seems accurate with the Pylontechs as per @Tariqand @Achmat - perhaps it doesn't communicate with Hubble well?) or that my brand new healthy battery is not so healthy ...
  10. @Achmat - I will check that tonight - I have done it on charging (and inverter and Solarman line up) but not on discharging.
  11. Thanks @leshen. I'll see what Hubble say this week. When you say no issues with other installations - does that mean you are seeing 0.55kwH per 10% SOC (per AM2) on these installations ?
  12. @leshen I am based in Cape Town. My installer is dealing with Hubble - we returned the battery last week - but their initial thought is that it is the BMS. They said they would swap it out for a new BMS this week and do some tests but can't replace the entire battery as they have no stock. Ideally, if it is faulty, I'd want a complete replacement, but have no idea when they will get stock. Do you think a new BMS is reasonable or would you wait for an entirely new one if it is not too long a wait? My installer granted me access to the plant via Business Solarman - so it appears as if I can't see or change the Calculation of Energy field. However, I don't think this is an issue because the manual suggests the default is Based on Device and in any event, it is only used to determine how to combine fields for more than a day i.e. for measurement during the same day, both methods will be the same. I'd be interested in what you are seeing on your Sunsynk/Hubble installations - as it stands, my remaining healthy battery (not the one I sent in) is underperforming its label capacity by over 10% (whilst @Tariq and @Achmat are seeing performance in line with expectations). I'd obviously like to be able to see if it is my particular battery or in fact the Hubble batteries behave like this in general. @Tariq, I doubt the graphs are 100% accurate, but are fairly close - you can probably remove most of the variation in measurement caused by rounding by doing it over a longer period - e.g. measure SOC from 100% to 60% and dividing by 4.
  13. Thanks @Achmat. Your looks spot on - so on a sample size of 2, your battery performance is looking true to label and mine is not! Will be interested to hear from others, especially Sunsynk/Hubble combos.
  14. Thanks Achmat. Below is a screen I use to measure it. "Total Discharging Energy" and "Total Charging Energy" under Device Data. These fields are cumulative so you need to calculate the difference. So, I have 2 snapshots below, one at 25% SOC and one earlier at 99% SOC. You'll see total charging energy hasn't changed over this period (there was no charging) but total discharging energy has changed by 3.6kwH. So, 3.6kwH were discharged for a 74% change in SOC. This is about 0.5kwH per 10% (a bit better than some of my other calcs, but the increments of measurement do affect the calc slightly). You can still do the calc even if there has been some charging over the period by offsetting the change in charging energy.
  15. I have a recently installed 8kw Sunsynk, 2 x Hubble AM2 batteries and 14 x 390W panels. Early on, I was a little bit concerned by the battery performance. When measuring the change in SOC vs the kwH discharged (from the Solarman app - I used the change in "Total Discharging Energy" to measure this and it was consistent with what I was seeing on the inverter panel), I was only getting an average of about 0.75kwH per 10% discharge (typically running SOC from 100% to 35%) . This implied a total capacity of 7.5kwH instead of the expected 11kwH. My installer, in consultation with Hubble, thought it might be an equalisation issue and charged and discharged both batteries using voltages (amongst other ideas). No joy - my installer agreed that one battery seemed to be underperforming and has returned it to Hubble for analysis. I have since been running only one battery whilst I wait for Hubble to resolve the issue with the other one. This one battery is discharging at a rate of about 0.47 kwH per 10% SOC change (typically running SOC from about 100% to 25%), implying a total capacity of about 4.7kwH. This is obviously much better, but still only about 86% of "labelled" capacity. Given that I will likely only run the battery down to say 25%, this means that on a 5.5kwh battery, I will only get about 3.6kwh out of it. So, my question is, does this seem reasonable? I understand that there can be measuring issues (on either or both the inverter and Solarman app) and that there will be some loss on conversion from 51V DC battery to 230V AC (although I'm not sure whether the inverter shows the kwH used before or after conversion), but 86% of actual capacity seems quite low to me. I'd be interested to know what other guys are getting (kwH used per 10% change in SOC), both those with the same setup, and those with different batteries. Thanks
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