Ariel Posted July 13 Share Posted July 13 (edited) Hi there, I have an inverter that was running with gel batteries and recently installed lithium batteries, about a month back. We recently had a fault in the road that caused loss of power, my inverter kicked in while we were sleeping but died, not sure when. The power came back on and was charging the batteries for at least 4 hours, yet when I did a test but killing the power to the mains, the inverter was beeping as it seemed like the batteries were low. So I don't think they are charging and now I think I must change the settings on the inverter, as its set to default. I have now set the following after doing some research: Bulk: 14.4v - 28.2 Float: 13.6v ( 13.5v for Must 1kva Inverter ) - 27.2 Cut Off: 11.2v - 22.4 This is what I have: GeeWiz Axpert 3000VA (3000W) PURE Sine Wave SOLAR Inverter - 50A/1200W PWM (Hybrid) GeeWiz 12100L 1.2kWh 12V 100Ah Lithium Ion LiFePO4 5000 Cycle Battery (FIRST LIFE CELLS) - 3 Year Unlimited Cycles Warranty - 5000 Cycles X 2 12.8V 1.2KWh Rating: 1C Maximum continuous discharge: 100Amp Cells: 1st life prismatic LiFePO4 Series: 2, 3 or 4 batteries Parallel: 4 Batteries Communication: None >5000 cycles at 80% DOD 3 Year Unlimited Cycles Warranty A balancer will be required when using these in series This battery has been built with cells that are designed for 5000 cycles (and comes with a 3 year warranty) Battery Voltages Bulk: 14.4v Float: 13.6v ( 13.5v for Must 1kva Inverter ) Cut Off: 11.2v Specifications 12.8V 1.2KWh Rating: 1C Maximum continuous discharge: 100Amp Cells: 1st life prismatic LiFePO4 Series: 2, 3 or 4 batteries Parallel: 4 Batteries Communication: None >5000 cycles at 80% DOD 3 Year Unlimited Cycles Warranty Features High Cycle Life and Service Life High Performance Lithium battery Internal Battery Management System Excellent high temperature performance High energy density and conversion efficiency Can be configured in 12V, 24V, 36V or 48V in series Easy drop in replacement for old lead acid battery installs BMS protects internal cells and ensures smooth operation Compatible with most UPS & Inverters using AGM/VRLA charge setting Built-in protection for over-charge, over-discharge & over-temperature External cell balancer required when placing in series to ensure balancing Perfect replacement Lithium solution for upgrading your lead acid installation Thank you Edited July 13 by Ariel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TaliaB Posted July 13 Share Posted July 13 20 minutes ago, Ariel said: Hi there, I have an inverter that was running with gel batteries and recently installed lithium batteries, about a month back. We recently had a fault in the road that caused loss of power, my inverter kicked in while we were sleeping but died, not sure when. The power came back on and was charging the batteries for at least 4 hours, yet when I did a test but killing the power to the mains, the inverter was beeping as it seemed like the batteries were low. So I don't think they are charging and now I think I must change the settings on the inverter, as its set to default. This is what I have: GeeWiz Axpert 3000VA (3000W) PURE Sine Wave SOLAR Inverter - 50A/1200W PWM (Hybrid) GeeWiz 12100L 1.2kWh 12V 100Ah Lithium Ion LiFePO4 5000 Cycle Battery (FIRST LIFE CELLS) - 3 Year Unlimited Cycles Warranty - 5000 Cycles X 2 12.8V 1.2KWh Rating: 1C Maximum continuous discharge: 100Amp Cells: 1st life prismatic LiFePO4 Series: 2, 3 or 4 batteries Parallel: 4 Batteries Communication: None >5000 cycles at 80% DOD 3 Year Unlimited Cycles Warranty A balancer will be required when using these in series This battery has been built with cells that are designed for 5000 cycles (and comes with a 3 year warranty) Features High Cycle Life and Service Life High Performance Lithium battery Internal Battery Management System Excellent high temperature performance High energy density and conversion efficiency Can be configured in 12V, 24V, 36V or 48V in series Easy drop in replacement for old lead acid battery installs BMS protects internal cells and ensures smooth operation Compatible with most UPS & Inverters using AGM/VRLA charge setting Built-in protection for over-charge, over-discharge & over-temperature External cell balancer required when placing in series to ensure balancing Perfect replacement Lithium solution for upgrading your lead acid installation Thank you We need more information to assist with your problem. Did you fully charge each lfp battery, before connecting them in series? Do you have solar panels connected to the Pwm of the inverter? What is the program settings on the inverter. Supply us settings on program 01,02,05,11,12,13,16,26,27,29 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ariel Posted July 13 Author Share Posted July 13 (edited) 3 minutes ago, TaliaB said: We need more information to assist with your problem. Did you fully charge each lfp battery, before connecting them in series? Do you have solar panels connected to the Pwm of the inverter? What is the program settings on the inverter. Supply us settings on program 01,02,05,11,12,13,16,26,27,29 Hi, I don't have solar, no I did not fully charge the batteries, they were just installed on 20th of June but the power has not gone off since they were installed. The settings were not changed before, I just changed the following settings now to match the info I was given with the batteries: Bulk: 14.4v - 28.2 Float: 13.6v ( 13.5v for Must 1kva Inverter ) - 27.2 Cut Off: 11.2v - 22.4 Edited July 13 by Ariel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TaliaB Posted July 13 Share Posted July 13 5 minutes ago, Ariel said: Hi, I don't have solar, no I did not fully charge the batteries, they were just installed on 20th of June but the power has not gone off since they were installed. The settings were not changed before, I just changed the following settings now to match the info I was given with the batteries: Bulk: 14.4v - 28.2 Float: 13.6v ( 13.5v for Must 1kva Inverter ) - 27.2 Cut Off: 11.2v - 22.4 Is program 05 set to USE as default would be AGM? What is program 02 and program 11 set at? Bulk is fine at 28.2v and float is ok at 27.2v but i will change Cut Off to 25.6v at 22.4v the batteries are less than 10%Soc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ariel Posted July 13 Author Share Posted July 13 9 minutes ago, TaliaB said: Is program 05 set to USE as default would be AGM? What is program 02 and program 11 set at? Bulk is fine at 28.2v and float is ok at 27.2v but i will change Cut Off to 25.6v at 22.4v the batteries are less than 10%Soc. I changed program 05 to USE when I changed the settings above. Program 02 is SOA Program 11 is 30A The highest I could set cut off to is 24, is this ok? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TaliaB Posted July 13 Share Posted July 13 13 minutes ago, Ariel said: I changed program 05 to USE when I changed the settings above. Program 02 is SOA Program 11 is 30A The highest I could set cut off to is 24, is this ok? Yes 24v is fine 3v/ cell. Do you have a multimeter? If you do have check the voltage of each battery and record the voltage. You will have to put a battery balancer between the 2 batteries to keep them relatively at the same soc. Below link for the balancer. https://www.geewiz.co.za/battery-balancers/185924-lithium-24v-battery-balancer-equaliser-suitable-for-all-battery-types-24v-2x-12v-batteries.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ariel Posted July 13 Author Share Posted July 13 (edited) Hi, thanks so much for your help! Yes I already have that installed. I have this Konnwei BK100 Wireless BT Car battery tester 100-2000 CCA 6V 12V - https://www.autosupply.co.za/product/konnwei-bk100-wireless-bt-car-battery-tester-100-2000-cca-6v-12v-bte-bk100/ - Though this I used to test my gel batteries, not sure if I can test Lithium with it. I think I must let it charge for longer before I test it, I did earlier after only 4 hours of charging but it said something was odd about the voltage. Edited July 13 by Ariel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ariel Posted July 13 Author Share Posted July 13 Assuming the battery tester I have works for Lithium batteries, does this look right? Is my one battery just needing a good charge that the score is so low? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TaliaB Posted July 14 Share Posted July 14 (edited) 9 hours ago, Ariel said: Assuming the battery tester I have works for Lithium batteries, does this look right? Is my one battery just needing a good charge that the score is so low? Switch the inverter off remove the link in your picture below and test each battery individually i assumed that you did above tests with the series link intact. I don't know the tester you are using but give it a try without the link. Ps after reading the specs of your tester i don't think the tester is compatible with Lfp or any lithuim battery. Compatibility – It is compatible with all 6 volt and 12 volt lead-acid batteries, including regular flooded, AGM flat plate, AGM spiral, GEL, and EFB batteries with testing range of 100-2000 CCA. Compatible with cars, motorcycles, trucks, RVs, ATVs, SUVs, boats, yachts, mowers, and even golf carts Edited July 14 by TaliaB Added comments Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scorp007 Posted July 14 Share Posted July 14 (edited) 11 hours ago, Ariel said: I think I must let it charge for longer before I test it, I did earlier after only 4 hours of charging but it said something was odd about the voltage. Yes something is odd here if I may but in. If the 2 batteries were charging for 4hrs there should be enough power in them to switch the inverter on and run a low load like laptop or TV at least for enough time. Even if the 2 batteries are out of balance. If the above can work just measure the voltage of each battery at the start of this basic test and provide the readings. Also check what current the inverter reports during charging if available on the screen. As your pictures show the 2 batteries at different SOC I would disconnect both. Use another piece of wire as per your series connection. Connect the 2xpos together and the 2xneg to put both in parallel and leave for about 3hrs. Do this with balanced disconnected. They would then balance faster than using the balancer. The balancer works gr8 ongoing. Just my 2c. Edited July 14 by Scorp007 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ariel Posted July 15 Author Share Posted July 15 On 2024/07/14 at 8:15 AM, TaliaB said: Switch the inverter off remove the link in your picture below and test each battery individually i assumed that you did above tests with the series link intact. I don't know the tester you are using but give it a try without the link. Ps after reading the specs of your tester i don't think the tester is compatible with Lfp or any lithuim battery. Compatibility – It is compatible with all 6 volt and 12 volt lead-acid batteries, including regular flooded, AGM flat plate, AGM spiral, GEL, and EFB batteries with testing range of 100-2000 CCA. Compatible with cars, motorcycles, trucks, RVs, ATVs, SUVs, boats, yachts, mowers, and even golf carts Hi, you are right I don't think its compatible, I have someone coming to install something on DB board and he will test the voltage for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ariel Posted July 22 Author Share Posted July 22 Hi, So I had the voltage checked: 13.1 and 13.2. I then did a test with a gaming computer and 65 inch tv on: Computer and TV on 234 input and output Power turned off at 10:36 Input 228 Battery displays 3/4 cells 12:36 - 2 hours later Battery displays 3/4 cells 13:10 If I turn a light on, it drops to 2 bars with bar 3 flashing. Light turned off straight away, went back to 3/4 cells. 13:36 - 3 hours later 2 cells remaining Power turned back on 3 hours of loadshedding tested. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ariel Posted July 22 Author Share Posted July 22 Hi, I had another question, There was no loadshedding or anything, we had power coming in from Eskom. With two computers on, a heater, a food warmer, everything was fine. But then the aircon was turned on without my knowledge and straight away it tripped the inverter. I had to to turn the inverter off and then on again. I understand that the overall wattage usage is too high and it caused it. I flipped the changeover switch to Eskom and then turned the inverter off and on. Is this normal that the inverter struggles with a high load even when there is power coming in from Eskom? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TaliaB Posted July 22 Share Posted July 22 16 minutes ago, Ariel said: Is this normal that the inverter struggles with a high load even when there is power coming in from Eskom? Yes especially the startup of the aircon the surge with other loads as mentioned would cause it to trip even with utility connected. Surge Capacity is 2* rated power for 5 seconds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scorp007 Posted July 22 Share Posted July 22 1 hour ago, Ariel said: Hi, I had another question, There was no loadshedding or anything, we had power coming in from Eskom. With two computers on, a heater, a food warmer, everything was fine. But then the aircon was turned on without my knowledge and straight away it tripped the inverter. I had to to turn the inverter off and then on again. I understand that the overall wattage usage is too high and it caused it. I flipped the changeover switch to Eskom and then turned the inverter off and on. Is this normal that the inverter struggles with a high load even when there is power coming in from Eskom? Even having just the aircon starting can/should overload the inverter. A 3kW can normally only supply 3kW even if it is connected to the grid. For sure the batteries will also battle at the 13.1-13.2V level starting the aircon. The bars on the battery level is designed for lead acid and of very little help using lithium. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ariel Posted July 22 Author Share Posted July 22 1 hour ago, TaliaB said: Yes especially the startup of the aircon the surge with other loads as mentioned would cause it to trip even with utility connected. Surge Capacity is 2* rated power for 5 seconds. If I flipped the changeover switch to eskom before turning on the aircon, then this would mean that it is bypassing the inverter and it would not cause an overload? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ariel Posted July 22 Author Share Posted July 22 40 minutes ago, Scorp007 said: Even having just the aircon starting can/should overload the inverter. A 3kW can normally only supply 3kW even if it is connected to the grid. For sure the batteries will also battle at the 13.1-13.2V level starting the aircon. The bars on the battery level is designed for lead acid and of very little help using lithium. Thank you, so yes must just make sure that my dad, he was the one who did it, does not have so many heating elements on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek3 Posted July 22 Share Posted July 22 (edited) 1 hour ago, Scorp007 said: Even having just the aircon starting can/should overload the inverter. Hi @Scorp007i run my Hisense 12000Btu aircon on my Rct vm3 24v inverter the power the aircon uses is 1680watts. I can use the cottage lights plus 2 tv sets and the fridge with the aircon and never had a trip. But then again i have 10kwh battery capacity. But that should not matter if you are utility connected and in pass through. Edited July 22 by Derek3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scorp007 Posted July 22 Share Posted July 22 (edited) 39 minutes ago, Derek3 said: Hi @Scorp007i run my Hisense 12000Btu aircon on my Rct vm3 24v inverter the power the aircon uses is 1680watts. I can use the cottage lights plus 2 tv sets and the fridge with the aircon and never had a trip. But then again i have 10kwh battery capacity. But that should not matter if you are utility connected and in pass through. But don't you have an inverter aircon and not the older type that have a high surge current? My Axpert 3kVA would trip out if it exceeds this value when on bypass or from battery. I have never tried the max on battery power only. Edited July 22 by Scorp007 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek3 Posted July 22 Share Posted July 22 (edited) 16 minutes ago, Scorp007 said: But don't you have an inverter aircon and not the older type that have a high surge current? My Axpert 3kVA would trip out if it exceeds this value when on bypass or from battery. I have never tried the max on battery power only. No my aircon is not the inverter type the normal wall split unit and i have run it for months now. Ps.I just can't switch the kettle on while the aircon is running otherwise it trips. Edited July 22 by Derek3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scorp007 Posted July 22 Share Posted July 22 (edited) 9 hours ago, Derek3 said: No my aircon is not the inverter type the normal wall split unit and i have run it for months now. That's a big bonus. I just thought it would be like some fridges. I have measured a peak of 1800W on a medium fridge during starting although the fridge would run at 130W. Edited July 23 by Scorp007 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TaliaB Posted July 22 Share Posted July 22 (edited) 5 hours ago, Derek3 said: No my aircon is not the inverter type the normal wall split unit and i have run it for months now. Ps.I just can't switch the kettle on while the aircon is running otherwise it trips. Hi Derek i think somewhere there is wires crossed. If memory serves me right your electrician( Skollie) did that 3kw installation in your cottage around March/April 23 as he stil phoned me to ask should he connect the aircon to the essential or non essential side so i told him to the non essential side. I have tested a 20000Btu with my IAMMETER and the startup current is 19~21amps for 486ms then it drops down to 7.3 amps. If the compressor cycles on and off you get that spike. I think because he used the existing db for both essential and non essential you may think it runs through the inverter. Check with Skollie tomorrow and let us know as i am here with @Scorp007on this one don't think the 3kw inverter could start the aircon. Looking forward to a favourable reply from your end Edited July 23 by TaliaB Edit changed incorrect startup time Scorp007 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek3 Posted July 23 Share Posted July 23 22 hours ago, Scorp007 said: But don't you have an inverter aircon and not the older type that have a high surge current? My Axpert 3kVA would trip out if it exceeds this value when on bypass or from battery. I have never tried the max on battery power only. 21 hours ago, TaliaB said: Hi Derek i think somewhere there is wires crossed. If memory serves me right your electrician( Skollie) did that 3kw installation in your cottage around March/April 23 as he stil phoned me to ask should he connect the aircon to the essential or non essential side so i told him to the non essential side. I have tested a 20000Btu with my IAMMETER and the startup current is 19~21amps for 486ms then it drops down to 7.3 amps. If the compressor cycles on and off you get that spike. I think because he used the existing db for both essential and non essential you may think it runs through the inverter. Check with Skollie tomorrow and let us know as i am here with @Scorp007on this one don't think the 3kw inverter could start the aircon. Looking forward to a favourable reply from your end Hi guys @Scorp007 @TaliaB i spoke to Skollie today and yes you where right my deepest apologies to both you guys the aircon is indeed connected to the non-essential side and is not powered by the 3kva inverter. So yes @TaliaByou where spot on with your statement that it is wired on the non-essential side powered by Escom. Scorp007 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek3 Posted July 23 Share Posted July 23 And apologies @Arielfor highjacking your thread. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scorp007 Posted July 23 Share Posted July 23 48 minutes ago, Derek3 said: And apologies @Arielfor highjacking your thread. I am sure as we dissect what can work and what not will at the end help someone. At least no shots are fired during this kind of hijacking Derek3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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