grid tied connection in Ekuruhleni

[AndewJ]

Does anyone know the procedure and cost to get a grid tied inverter connected to the Ekurhuleni municipality grid? 

[Guest]

In CPT about +-R10k for the engineers report, about R2500 for a new meter ... to do it legally,

If you do it cheaper with just a electrician, and one day the rules get put in place / enforced, you may have to face the costs or disconnect.

[AndewJ]

7 hours ago, The Terrible Triplett said:

In CPT about +-R10k for the engineers report, about R2500 for a new meter ... to do it legally,

If you do it cheaper with just a electrician, and one day the rules get put in place / enforced, you may have to face the costs or disconnect.

thank you. I know Cape Town has this in place already but cannot find anything for Ekuruhleni yet. 

[Guest]

3 hours ago, AndewJ said:

find anything for Ekuruhleni y

Jip, CPT is doing the ground breaking work, the rest will follow in due course once the stealing has been addressed.

[Chris Hobson]

1 hour ago, The Terrible Triplett said:

....... once the stealing has been addressed.

You can throw cold water on that idea. Never mind just throw the whole jug!. 

[Guest]

21 minutes ago, Chris Hobson said:

You can throw cold water on that idea. Never mind just throw the whole jug!. 

Nope.

Pe, Jhb and Pta has started the cleanup processes and, as I expected since their takeover, the violence has also started to surface this week. Jip, I expected that, was wayyyy to easy. 

So patience my man patience. The more desperate the pawns become, the bigger the chances get to address the thefts for the card house is crumbling, from the top down.

So much so I hear a distant zuuuuuuuum sound building - appears to be coming from a office holder who may be preparing to take a very fast leave of office due to a huge influx of "chickens" coming home to roost. Reminds me of a buildup to a tsunami.

So Gordhan's hint on going nuclear with information ... Go Gordhan go ... you KNOW you have to.
Gordhan for President.
Viva Gordhan.
Viva SA. 

[Chris Hobson]

42 minutes ago, Chris Hobson said:

You can throw cold water on that idea. Never mind just throw the whole jug!. 

Tongue in cheek reference to the ANC's antics in PE municipality this week.

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, Chris Hobson said:

Tongue in cheek reference to the ANC's antics in PE municipality this week.

Jip, with the election results so extremely close, and EFF the king maker, the change happened so fast and no-one saw that one coming.

So the shock is now over and now the anger is stepping in. Next move I see is when even more cash flows are stopped, that anger is going to fuel more angries. All perfectly normal.

 

The point is that crime in municipalities are going to get addressed and then eventually the T&C's for grid tie is going to filter though to everyone in SA, in due course.

[SOLARWIND]

On 10/29/2016 at 10:11 AM, The Terrible Triplett said:

Jip, CPT is doing the ground breaking work, the rest will follow in due course once the stealing has been addressed.

While it is good to have rules in place and standardize on safety, my honest opinion is that the CoCT is busy hi-jacking RE in such a way as to take away all the joy from medium income to poor guys trying to save a buck on electricity bills.

[Guest]

11 minutes ago, SOLARWIND said:

... my honest opinion is that the CoCT is busy hi-jacking RE in such a way as to take away all the joy from medium income to poor guys trying to save a buck on electricity bills.

You have the right to that opinion but having listened to podcasts where they explained the situation answering public questions, where I emailed them direct and getting answers, I respectfully disagree.

The problem is not just the municipalities, the problem is the national grid, the fact that there are no sun at night, wind unreliable, the maintenance of the grid, subsidizing the poor, the Camel - vs the Duck-shaped power curve on the grid and renewable energy ... I can go on and on.

It is not an ideal situation, no, it is not fair, no, and it is by far not as easy as we would like to make out it is.

On top of it all, they have and are doing a lot of research of what has and is transpiring recently in the USA and Europe, where they have actually reversed, overnight, the incentives, buy-back of power.

We had this discussion on the forum before. See one of them here: 

And here:

 http://powerforum.co.za/topic/442-my-application-has-gone-in/?do=findComment&comment=6359

[SOLARWIND]

1 hour ago, The Terrible Triplett said:

You have the right to that opinion but having listened to podcasts where they explained the situation answering public questions, where I emailed them direct and getting answers, I respectfully disagree.

The problem is not just the municipalities, the problem is the national grid, the fact that there are no sun at night, wind unreliable, the maintenance of the grid, subsidizing the poor, the Camel - vs the Duck-shaped power curve on the grid and renewable energy ... I can go on and on.

It is not an ideal situation, no, it is not fair, no, and it is by far not as easy as we would like to make out it is.

On top of it all, they have and are doing a lot of research of what has and is transpiring recently in the USA and Europe, where they have actually reversed, overnight, the incentives, buy-back of power.

We had this discussion on the forum before. See one of them here: 

And here:

 http://powerforum.co.za/topic/442-my-application-has-gone-in/?do=findComment&comment=6359

I think we should all look further and then make up our minds on whether it is fair or not. http://reneweconomy.com.au/rooftop-solar-on-every-australian-household-no-issue-at-all-for-grid-74077/

 

[SOLARWIND]

Here's one more:

http://reneweconomy.com.au/the-myth-of-renewables-threatening-grid-stability-17082/

 

[___]

CoCT understands what is at stake. You have several issues converging, the proverbial rock and a hard place. Renewable energy is becoming more affordable and the rich guys (and big business) are increasingly leaving the traditional funding pool. Because of the local ruling party's commitment to outdoing the other guys, they take their poverty alleviation projects seriously. Problem with that is, every housing project you complete needs even more FBE (Free Basic Electricity) and someone has to pay for it. So you have to give away more free stuff and your funders are leaving. So they are doing a few things:

They are brutally fair about moving people to the domestic tariff. If you use too much or you live in a nice house, they will move you from lifeline to domestic. This is important: Last year they managed to cap the increase to 6.8% by moving a block of users that were on the wrong tariff. Of course the decision wasn't popular among some of those who got ported to the new tariff.

If you register for SSEG, they restructure your tariff. Remember that the cost of maintaining the network is subsidised out of electricity sales. When you start buying less electricity, you are also paying less for maintenance. This is only sustainable up to a certain point. Other municipalities have connection fees to deal with this. If you also sell electricity back to them, you are technically using their infrastructure to make money. They therefore change your structure so you pay for the infrastructure separately. Of course this removes much of the motivation to go solar if you use 200kwh to 600kwh a month -- because the connection fee is R400 a month.

If you look at it from a grid-tied perspective, and you compare the R400 for the grid to the cost of maintaining batteries, it doesn't seem that bad to me.

You can also request to remain on the domestic tariff if you have a grid-limiter fitted.

The one thing that does get in the way though is the difficulty of signing a system off, the cost of getting the correct kind of engineer to do it.

I agree that the formalisation of the process does take a  lot of fun out of it, but it really seems kind of unavoidable given the political and legal situation in the country.

[SOLARWIND]

I am aware of all you mention and I understand their reasoning, but in that case, if I do not use the grid at all and go totally off grid, they also lose out and I don't buy electricity from them. If I however choose to keep the municipal supply and stay physically disconnected from my "generator" I can keep on paying only what I consume, with the understanding that I'll mainly use my solar generated power with a change-over switch (break-before-make and with the appropriate CoC for the solar installation and a CoC for the change-over switch).

I quote: " If you would like to operate a small-scale embedded generator (SSEG) within the municipality's boundaries, that is synchronised with the City's electrical network, you will need to follow the below process. If you plan to operate the generator outside of the City's electrical network, you need not submit an application to Electrical Services."

As far as I understand this, it means that you only have to apply if you are going to generate and feed back, i.e. you will have to be synchronised with the electricity network. The opposite is then also true, i.e. if you are not synchronised it means you do not have to register because you are not connected. Unfortunately this implies that you'll need batteries. This need not be to big or expensive as you will have to switch over to mains at night.

[___]

I think coct just wanted to plug the holes they could. Once someone goes off grid there is little they can do.

Sent from my GT-I9195 using Tapatalk

[Guest]

12 hours ago, SOLARWIND said:

I think we should all look further and then make up our minds on whether it is fair or not.

Yes, I have read similar articles. As with the global warming debate, it goes backwards and forwards between the two camps.

Anyone can go off-grid. But I saw that once you start generating your own power that you become acutely aware of the same yet "minuscule" problems one has to deal with, and the costs involved, when compared to a national scale.

Hairdryer starts whilst microwave and washing machine and fridge all starts, system tripps. On a national scale, sun sets and we all arrive home and start cooking. It is a lifestyle change, or it is going to cost more.

We cannot get rid of power stations if we go all green power. They must still operate and it is very costly to keep them on for when they need to operate. And the maintenance of all the millions of parts keeping the grid going also cost money on top of that.

And SA overall is not going to easily go for lifestyle changes.

My conclusion: The answer is mini grids, grids the size of a suburb for example. For that to work, the entire grid needs to be redone. You need to manage it much more actively on a smaller scale.

[Guest]

@SOLARWIND Just got his in: http://www.wealthdaily.com/articles/a-rigged-system-on-the-verge-of-collapse-utilities-monopoly-solar-energy-rooftop/8406

[SOLARWIND]

17 minutes ago, The Terrible Triplett said:

@SOLARWIND Just got his in: http://www.wealthdaily.com/articles/a-rigged-system-on-the-verge-of-collapse-utilities-monopoly-solar-energy-rooftop/8406

TTT, this is exactly the right fuel to awaken the rebel in me! Thanks for the link!

[SilverNodashi]

On 11/5/2016 at 11:11 AM, The Terrible Triplett said:

Yes, I have read similar articles. As with the global warming debate, it goes backwards and forwards between the two camps.

Anyone can go off-grid. But I saw that once you start generating your own power that you become acutely aware of the same yet "minuscule" problems one has to deal with, and the costs involved, when compared to a national scale.

Hairdryer starts whilst microwave and washing machine and fridge all starts, system tripps. On a national scale, sun sets and we all arrive home and start cooking. It is a lifestyle change, or it is going to cost more.

We cannot get rid of power stations if we go all green power. They must still operate and it is very costly to keep them on for when they need to operate. And the maintenance of all the millions of parts keeping the grid going also cost money on top of that.

And SA overall is not going to easily go for lifestyle changes.

My conclusion: The answer is mini grids, grids the size of a suburb for example. For that to work, the entire grid needs to be redone. You need to manage it much more actively on a smaller scale.

You can adapt to using such a system. Ask PaulF or Chris Hobbs how they cope with an off-grid system, and limited power availability. You learn to adapt your lifestyle paterns a bit. And install 16A or 20A breakers throughout the DB board