Hi guys

Yesterday I setup system with Axpert King 5000 and Pylontech US5000. Main firmware 72.00, bluetooth 00.24
No solar panels, just for work as an UPS.
The RJ45 cable from the battery cables pack doesn't match (got error 61) so I just setup battery as USER type.
Voltages are:
12 - 48
13 - 51
26 - 52.5
27 - 51.8
29 - 47.5

So the battery charged full and all 6 leds on the battery are lighting.
The problem is how inverter show SOC and warn about low battery.

First problem:
Just in a minute of discharging after grid outage inverter show 50% SOC.

Is It normal? As I understand it's because the inverter doesn't properly know LiFePO4 discharging voltage curve.

Wil the inverter show SOC properly after I will connect rs485 with proper cable?

Second problem:
After a 40 min battery voltage drops to 49.6V (afaik it's ok for 15 cells battery for less then 5% DOD) and inverter shown 19% SOC. At this moment it begun to alarming with error 04 (low battery). At the same time the battery still show all 6 leds on (so it's ok). Right now I just disabled this annoing buzzer.
So, how to properly set inverter settings to stop alarming when the buttery still almost not discharged yet? Will it be fixed after connect rs485?

Thanks in advance!
 PS. right now, after 50 min it shows 49.7V and 20% SOC
 

Edited January 24, 20233 yr by Vitaliy

On 2023/01/24 at 5:55 PM, Vitaliy said:

Just in a minute of discharging after grid outage inverter show 50% SOC.

Is It normal? As I understand it's because the inverter doesn't properly know LiFePO4 discharging voltage curve.

Yes. You can't trust the inverter's SoC unless you have the cable working. It might be worth trying harder to get the cable working.

On 2023/01/24 at 5:55 PM, Vitaliy said:

After a 40 min battery voltage drops to 49.6V (afaik it's ok for 15 cells battery for less then 5% DOD) and inverter shown 19% SOC. At this moment it begun to alarming with error 04 (low battery).

Try setting 29 at 46.0 V. There is an undocumented linkage between that setting and low battery warnings. I suggested 46.5 V to try and keep the SoC higher, but in hindsight it's probably not a great idea. You might have to go even lower on that setting. The inverter can't be used for saving the cells from low voltage; the BMS has to do that job.

When Weber and I finally get the fully patched firmware for Kings done, you will have better options.

[ Edit: Setting 49 -> Setting 29 ]

Edited January 27, 20233 yr by Coulomb

3 hours ago, Coulomb said:

Yes. You can't trust the inverter's SoC unless you have the cable working. It might be worth trying harder to get the cable working.

Thank you, mate!
I going to make a proper rs485 cable, just need to buy the rj45 crimper tool (my is too old and isn't working well), a 2m patch cord and I already have connectors. Hope with the right cable all will work as expected without tricks with voltages. Not sure if it is safe for the inverter when BMS will cut-off itself on low voltage. As far as I remember King is not declared as capable to work witout a battery.

But last weeks we have +- predictable outages. It's about no more than 6h grid outage and not less than 3h grid on in continue. So in these conditions, I haven't seen the battery had discharged more than 2 LEDs of 6 (~67% SOC). The discharge current of the battery when it feeds my house is usually an average value 3-5A.

So it looks too far from battery cut-off in such conditions, at least until our electrical infrastructure will get more damage from yet another hit or something will get broken and schedules will become stricter.

Edited January 25, 20233 yr by Vitaliy

Made the RG45 cable. as described here

pinout from US5000 manual:


So I connected brown 8 to 3 on inverter side and white-brown 7 to 5. Checked cable with tester. Seems ok.
Of course set 9600 bps.

And it still doesn't work...
After switch to PYL battery it waits for about 3 min and shown error 61.
Voltages resets to 
26->48
27->48
29->40.
SOC->100%
I tried both port B and port A on battery side. 
So returned to USER battery

13 hours ago, Vitaliy said:

And it still doesn't work...

I think that they may have changed the RS-485 pinout between the US2000 and the US5000.

6 hours ago, Coulomb said:

I think that they may have changed the RS-485 pinout between the US2000 and the US5000.

May be. I changed cut-off value to 46v as you suggested and now it indeed works not bad, I even turned on alarm sound. So going to leave it as is for some time. I will try to make cable 1,2->3,5 as I saw here on forum. But not nearest days.

Today a couple of grid infrastructure objects got a damage again. So not the best time for experiments.. Need workable solution during waiting a few days to ensure that energy company will maked required repair and outages stabilized

Edited January 26, 20233 yr by Vitaliy

On 2023/01/25 at 5:27 AM, Coulomb said:

Yes. You can't trust the inverter's SoC unless you have the cable working. It might be worth trying harder to get the cable working.

Try setting 49 at 46.0 V. There is an undocumented linkage between that setting and low battery warnings. I suggested 46.5 V to try and keep the SoC higher, but in hindsight it's probably not a great idea. You might have to go even lower on that setting. The inverter can't be used for saving the cells from low voltage; the BMS has to do that job.

When Weber and I finally get the fully patched firmware for Kings done, you will have better options.

I guess you mean setting 29 instead of 49?

10 hours ago, Coulomb said:

I think that they may have changed the RS-485 pinout between the US2000 and the US5000.

They didn't change it as you can see above in the US2000 and US5000 manuals.

@VitaliyPlease double check your cable, it should work.

I have recently installed a Axpert King (1) 5K and a US5000 at a friends place and it worked.

Edited January 26, 20233 yr by birdibird

34 minutes ago, birdibird said:

I guess you mean setting 29 instead of 49?

Yes, you are right, mate. My bad 

 

I just bought 2m patchcord and cut one side (to inverter). Then cut all wires except brown pair and crimped new connector.

Just checked the cable again right now. 8b connected to 3i and 7b to 5i (b - battery, i-inverter). As I think should be. No shortcut between wires in the pair.

Have no idea why it doesn't work. 

Maybe will play again with this on weekend.

 

Ps. It's interesting that in us5000 manual in description of pinout of link ports they said to not use 1-3 pins because it may interfer communications with inverter. So it may brings up idea that us5000 uses 1-2 rs485 pair for inverter. 

Edited January 26, 20233 yr by Vitaliy

Hello, I think I have found a solution with a standard pylontech cable and an update of the panel

Edited January 27, 20233 yr by malo

21 hours ago, birdibird said:

I guess you mean setting 29 instead of 49?

Yes, thanks for the correction.

21 hours ago, Vitaliy said:

21 hours ago, birdibird said:

I guess you mean setting 29 instead of 49?

Yes, you are right, mate. My bad 

That was actually my post that had the wrong setting number, sorry. I've edited the original.

4 hours ago, malo said:

Hello, I think I have found a solution with a standard pylontech cable and an update of the panel

Thanks, mate
As far as I got from the video without knowing language is that he solved 61 error issue by flashing fresh firmware to display box. Update from some too old version to 102.73. 
I have 102.71 and have exactly the same cable. It's possible that a bug still exists in 102.71 and fixed in 102.73, but I'm not going to upgrade firmware in near future. Need to keep workable solution even if it not perfect. Will just try to play again with what I already have in hands. 

I personally followed his instructions with his files and the communication passes with a cable of 3/5 Inverter /  7/8 - > with US5000.

So I bought cable, connectors, 2 rj45 outlets to easier testing and prepared today 3 cables.

2 cables with 87b->35i pinout

1 cable with 12b->35i pinout

Results

1. Cable 87b->35i to port B/rs485 on pylontech. Connection timeout. Error 61

2. Cable 12b->35i to port B on pylontech. Connection timeout. Error 61

3. Cable 87b->35i to port A/can on pylontech. Connection firstly seems established. Battery sigh began blinking. But immediately after that it shown error 04 (low battery), and after a minute error 61. It changed settings

26 -> 48V

27 -> 48V

29 -> 0V

max charging current -> 10A

4. Cable 12b->35i to port A on pylontech. Connection timeout. Error 61

 

So no luck with connecting. Returned again on USER battery type.

@Vitaliy, I confirm that the approach suggested by @malo is working. It solved today the problem 61 between my Axper King 5000 and two US5000 batteries. 

16 minutes ago, RomanCh said:

@Vitaliy, I confirm that the approach suggested by @malo is working. It solved today the problem 61 between my Axper King 5000 and two US5000 batteries. 

Hi mate

Thanks for good news!

Where, btw, did you get the firmware? I need for King I.

Not sure that from VM III, VM IV, and MAX (referred in the video) is compatible with King

Edited January 30, 20233 yr by Vitaliy

I used the firmware posted by @Coulomb 

 

15 hours ago, Vitaliy said:

Hi mate

Thanks for good news!

Where, btw, did you get the firmware? I need for King I.

Not sure that from VM III, VM IV, and MAX (referred in the video) is compatible with King

Yes, this is correct. If you update the display firmware, the newer Pylontechs will be supported.

You will need to double check what the current display firmware is in Watchpower (not on the display itself as only the last 4 digits are shown).
The newest for the King is 02.81 or 102.73 (see the files on this forum) depending on the display hardware.

Flashing the new firmware with the included Rj45 - RS232 cable and a bought RS232 - USB cable is very easy.
It is absolutely worth doing it as the inverter will then know the exact SoC and will not give you random warning 04 when you use a strong load.
 

btw @CoulombDo you already have a patched main firmware for the King based on the 72.00 version here on the forum?

6 minutes ago, birdibird said:

Do you already have a patched main firmware for the King based on the 72.00 version here on the forum?

No. Weber and I started on a 71.80 factory firmware last year (I think), but things got in the way. Weber recently pointed out to me that we need to get on with this, and that his current project will be finished in a few days, so we can start again soon. It will of course be based on King factory firmware 72.00 and whatever display firmware is the latest. Probably the versions mentioned two posts ago.

This will be a "fully patched" set, though it's possible we might skip some or all of the display improvements, since so few people use displays any mode (most seem to use some form of monitoring software). But let us know: do you care about display improvements, like being able to choose upper and lower data (battery voltage/current PV voltage/current AC voltage/power etc) independently? Do you care about "font" improvements?

Sorry for the very long delay!

Edited January 31, 20233 yr by Coulomb

33 minutes ago, birdibird said:

Yes, this is correct. If you update the display firmware, the newer Pylontechs will be supported.

You will need to double check what the current display firmware is in Watchpower (not on the display itself as only the last 4 digits are shown).
The newest for the King is 02.81 or 102.73 (see the files on this forum) depending on the display hardware.

Flashing the new firmware with the included Rj45 - RS232 cable and a bought RS232 - USB cable is very easy.
It is absolutely worth doing it as the inverter will then know the exact SoC and will not give you random warning 04 when you use a strong load.
 

Thanks!

I have no idea where WatchPower shows display firmware version, but according display itself it seems compatible.

Btw, am i guess right that only dsp firmware could be updated via usb flash drive (dsp.hex file way) and display has only rs232 way?

And second question - should i power it from gasoline generator during firmware update process to avoid brick the display due to unexpected grid outage? Or battery itself is enough protection for flashing.

EDIT. Found some answers here https://forums.aeva.asn.au/viewtopic.php?p=72173#p72173

Edited January 31, 20233 yr by Vitaliy

25 minutes ago, Coulomb said:

This will be a "fully patched" set, though it's possible we might skip some or all of the display improvements, since so few people use displays any mode (most seem to use some form of monitoring software). But let us know: do you care about display improvements, like being able to choose upper and lower data (battery voltage/current PV voltage/current AC voltage/power etc) in

It's interesting. Do you have access to sources of firmwares? Or just patching the binary?

13 hours ago, Vitaliy said:

Or just patching the binary?

Yes, just patching the binary. And unlike source code, if a new version comes out, there is no "binary merge" or even "binary diff". Unless the change is really trivial, and the addresses of every instruction stays the same (happened about once in my experience).