May be there are other things to consider..

I´m sure Axperts 2017 or 2018 inyects reactive power to grid, even in battery mode, when grid is available. I don´t know if Gabriel´s do the same. @weber or @Coulomb will know.

For example, in a test I did, in battery mode with a fridge runnig on grid available, active power and apparent power were the same 114 W and 114 VA. If  the grid isn´t available, in Battery Mode too, active power was 114 W, but apparent power was 140 VA.

what does all this mean? Run with ongrid available is better for the High Side of the Axpert. Less current, less voltage surges coming from motors or other unclumped loads....

 

Edited December 12, 20187 yr by Javi Martínez

On 2018/12/12 at 10:40 PM, Javi Martínez said:

For example, in a test I did, in battery mode with a fridge runnig on grid available, active power and apparent power were the same 114 W and 114 VA.

Axperts will never admit that their measurements result in more reactive power than real power. [ Edit : I screwed that up. They'll never report more real power than apparent power. Please see Weber's post about 12 posts down.] So it might have measured say 117 VA and reported it as 114. All that means is that the LC filter on the output of the inverter is swamping the output with reactance, so the power factor with the low fridge-only load is near zero.

It's not clear to me why the VA figure is different when AC is available. Maybe the bus voltage has to be a little higher and that affects the current to and from the filter.

In any case, I don't think you can make meaningful predictions from this. 

Edited December 14, 20187 yr by Coulomb

1 hour ago, Coulomb said:

Axperts will never admit that their measurements result in more reactive power than real power. So it might have measured say 117 VA and reported it as 114. All that means is that the LC filter on the output of the inverter is swamping the output with reactance, so the power factor with the low fridge-only load is near zero.

It's not clear to me why the VA figure is different when AC is available. Maybe the bus voltage has to be a little higher and that affects the current to and from the filter.

In any case, I don't think you can make meaningful predictions from this. 

I´ve done the test again with a charger as load, and this are the results:

Grid Off : ['001.0', '00.0', '229.0', '50.0', '0469', '0288', '015', '383', '27.33', '000', '100', '0664', '0000', '027.4', '27.39', '00016', '10010110', '00', '03', '00000', '100B<']

Grid On:   ['225.0', '50.0', '228.0', '50.0', '0287', '0287', '009', '382', '27.29', '000', '100', '0667', '0000', '027.4', '27.36', '00016', '10010110', '00', '03', '00000', '100']

 

Off grid: Aparent Power is 469 W and Active Power 288

Grid On: Aparent Power 287 W and Active Power 287 too.

 

Twice results in Battery Mode

Edited December 12, 20187 yr by Javi Martínez

24 minutes ago, Javi Martínez said:

Off grid: Aparent Power is 469 W and Active Power 288

Grid On: Aparent Power 287 W and Active Power 287 too.

pardon my ignorance, i follow this conversation in a vain attempt to figure out what it means in 'plain english' - so maybe you guys can help [i'm sure i am not the only one... ]

@gabriel In picture above, you can see inverter is in "battery mode" but, there is current trough AC IN Line, you can see the measurement of current, 0,438 A.

If you Switch Off AC IN Line, that current, which is related to Reactive Power, should "go" to the inverter.

But I don´t know if it works the same in older Axperts...

let's create a thread 'axpert feeding into grid?' or something, it looks weird to me...  

17 hours ago, gabriel said:

let's create a thread 'axpert feeding into grid?' or something, it looks weird to me...  

Hi @gabriel. If you have raspberry I have a sketch which would be easy to adapt you need.  No wires, only a USB wire from pi to Axpert. Tell us and we can adapt code.

16 minutes ago, Javi Martínez said:

If you have raspberry

hi @Javi Martínez, no i do not have on ...

2 hours ago, Javi Martínez said:

have raspberry

Only one man would dare to give me the raspberry!

14 minutes ago, plonkster said:

Only one man would dare to give me the raspberry!

mmm

20 minutes ago, plonkster said:

Only one man would dare to give me the raspberry!

I think most missed the reference ... here you go ....

 

Favourite scene from that movie: The "When will then be now" bit. Also the most hilarious example of breaking the 4th wall.

2 hours ago, plonkster said:

most hilarious example of breaking the 4th wall.

breaking the 1st glass 🤪 ... hey guys we have a full set of emojis ☺️😍🤨😈👵💛🐯🦋🍠🥃🏰🌦️💲🛠️⚠️♂️....

I suspect both @Javi Martínez and @Coulomb are confused here. There is no way that an Axpert can inject reactive power, or any kind of power, into the grid. The Axpert draws reactive power from the grid, even in battery mode, because it has capacitors connected across the grid. This is perfectly normal. 0.4 A is not surprising.

I suspect Coulomb mixed up his true, reactive and apparent powers when he wrote: "Axperts will never admit that their measurements result in more reactive power than real power". First, Axperts don't attempt to display reactive power (VAr) at all, and second, real power (W) is always the smallest of the two numbers that it does display. I suspect he really meant to write "Axperts will never admit that their measurements occasionally show more real power (W) than apparent power (VA)". And neither should they, since it is physically impossible for real power to be greater than apparent power. But this seems, to me, completely irrelevant to either of the two phenomena that Javi reports.

The second phenomenon that Javi reports is that the apparent power (VA) number suddenly drops to becomes the same as the true power (W) number, simply by connecting the grid to the Axpert's grid input, with no change to the load, and while still powering the load from the battery, not the grid.

This is indeed strange. But I don't believe it has anything to do with the fact that the Axpert draws a little reactive current from the grid, even when in battery mode and not charging from the grid. My PIP-4048MS (equivalent to the 4 kW Axpert MKS 5K-48) continues to show apparent power (VA) greater than true power (W) no matter whether the grid is connected or not, and no matter whether the loads are powered from the battery or the grid.

This sounds like a bug in the firmware. Javi, what make and model is your inverter, and what U1 firmware version does it have?

Edited December 14, 20187 yr by weber

• Brand:EASUN POWER
• Model:ISolar SPV 3K

 

['VERFW:00004.24']

['VERFW2:00003.27;']

 

But I´ve seen you are right. I thought measurement from inverter were useful but they aren´t. 

I´ve done the test again with an amp meter and is the same current on grid or not.
 

@weber

Edited December 14, 20187 yr by Javi Martínez