What is the difference between the Multiplus and the Multiplus II specs wise?

I think the II is cheaper?

I did hear talk that the II complies with Cape Town regulations?

The only Victron I can find on the Cape Town list is the Grid

which is no longer made!

Edited April 2, 20197 yr by Mistral

8 minutes ago, Mistral said:

1 - I think the II is cheaper?
2 - I did hear talk that the II complies with Cape Town regulations?

Both Yes.

Multiplus II is the latest newest one, grid tied approved for CoCT.

Multiplus is a older model, not approved, spec wise they do the same thing if it is the same 3kva model.

Still a few Multifrid's out there somewhere, me and Plonskter both have them. Go for the Multiplus II

Edited April 2, 20197 yr by Guest

Multiplus has an aluminium case and is more expensive. Multiplus-II has a steel case and is cheaper.

Multiplus-II has a lower no-load draw. 11W compared to around 35W for the older model.

Multiplus-II has NRS097-2-1, the older ones (excluding the MultiGrid) doesn't.

You want to buy a Multiplus-II 🙂

I found this the other day, what is interesting is that there is a Hardware rev. 08 and up difference on the AC-Out 2 . Apparently there is a tripping issue when the AC-Out 1 and 2 share a neutral? 

 

 

MultiPlus-II-to-MultiGrid-and-MultiPlus-comparison-EN (1).pdf

Thanks everyone!.

 

 

1 hour ago, PaBz0r said:

Apparently there is a tripping issue when the AC-Out 1 and 2 share a neutral? 

Tell me more?

I know the Multigrid is very sensitive ito what is on the circuits, and that your earthing is spot on.

On the one hand I think it's a cosmetic expense.

If lightning gets you properly, there isn't much in a box that could do anything about it.

On the other hand, that's no reason to do nothing.

For an installation in the Drakensberg, that I am busy with, this is what I have done:

I have a sharp pointed lightening conductor on the south of the panels heavily conductored directly to a deep earth spike bonded to the property fence.

The panels themselves are separately earthed to another earth spike ( close but not directly on the other earth spike).

The +ve and -ve legs of DC wiring from the panels  pass through a ferrite bead. This introduces an inductance that is a high impedance for surges.

I haven't yet, but I plan to install bi-directional Transil diodes upstream of the ferrite beads.

This should divert high-frequency surges.

The transil diodes will be L-G; N-G & L-N and rated at 150V. ( Which is my MPPT's maximum V rating).

Transil diodes are about a thousand times faster  than conventional surge protection and reseal (up to a limit).

Wikipedia claims pico-second voltage clamping, but I don't believe anything is that fast. Nevertheless, I'll settle for micro-second clamping.

Although they are small and relatively cheap they usually rated for 1.5kW, which translates to a whole lot of current for a few micro-seconds.

This may or may not be acceptable to your insurance, but it is way cheaper and I'd wager more likely to protect your downstream equipment if anything can.

I also intend to install a 68V transil diode across the 48V batteries, as well as suitably rated transil diodes on the AC ins and outs of the inverters.

Where this installation is, it is almost a sure thing that it will get hit by lightning, it already survives nearby strikes at least bi-weekly at this time of year.

 

 

 

Here is some more dope on the transil diode I intend to use on the PV panel side.

Ferrite beads are plenty cheap, and these diodes are about 30 cent (euro) a piece.

1.5KE130A-E3-54.pdf

Sorry, everyone these replies were meant for @Pietpower on another thread.

1 hour ago, The Terrible Triplett said:

Tell me more?

I know the Multigrid is very sensitive ito what is on the circuits, and that your earthing is spot on.

I was hoping somebody else might be able to answer based on the drawing on page two for the different hardware versions

An installer just mentioned that it might be an additional cost as they had a lot of tripping issues related to it. By not using AC2, this should not be an issue apparently, but I am not sure what the downside of that would be?

 

32 minutes ago, PaBz0r said:

By not using AC2 ...

We don't use AC2, just AC_out1 for the always on loads, when grid tied. 

AC_out2 limits the max amount of amps, so by not using it, the limit is the DB board's breakers, when grid tied.

Plonskter and I have / had tripping issues and we did not use AC_out2. The Multigrid is very sensitive, in my case, earth that was never properly done now I have a TN-C-S connection, and then these plugs with surge arrestors in them. They tend to make the Multigrid trip.

The Multiplus-II is less sensitive I believe. The sensitive Multigrid, not a problem either.

39 minutes ago, PaBz0r said:

By not using AC2, this should not be an issue apparently, but I am not sure what the downside of that would be?

MP II 3000 here.....I'm only hooked up for UPS & AC2 ain't used, only pulled criticals to the inverter, rest got left on the db - had no issues...no idea where to find which HW version it is, don't see it in the consol. 

2 minutes ago, The Terrible Triplett said:

We don't use AC2, just AC_out1 for the always on loads, when grid tied. 

AC_out2 limits the max amount of amps, so by not using it, the limit is the DB board's breakers, when grid tied.

Plonskter and I have / had tripping issues and we did not use AC_out2. The Multigrid is very sensitive, in my case, earth that was never properly done now I have a TN-C-S connection, and then these plugs with surge arrestors in them. They tend to make the Multigrid trip.

The Multiplus-II is less sensitive I believe. The sensitive Multigrid, not a problem either.

Thanks, then also a CG comes back into play.

 

Just now, 2una said:

MP II 3000 here.....I'm only hooked up for UPS & AC2 ain't used, only pulled criticals to the inverter, rest got left on the db - had no issues...no idea where to find which HW version it is, don't see it in the consol. 

I was wondering about your install and if you maybe had issues. Thats good to know as well, thanks!

3 minutes ago, PaBz0r said:

Thanks, then also a CG comes back into play.

 

YES! It lifts the constraint of the max inverter amps and simplifies the install at +-R1200 costs.

And you get all that data of what goes into and out of the DB, for free. 🙂 

Edited April 2, 20197 yr by Guest

46 minutes ago, PaBz0r said:

I was hoping somebody else might be able to answer based on the drawing on page two for the different hardware versions

@plonkster the best person.

All I know, get a Multiplus-II, not the Multigrid, unless you must have a 24v system.

Do I need one of these?

What is a CG?

 

Then also a CG comes back into play.

5 minutes ago, Mistral said:

What is a CG?

Carlo Gavazzi ET112 installed in your DB, immediately after the main breaker, connect to a VenusGX.

Thanks it is already on my list.

... welcome to the Victron gang, also paid deposit on my setup, being installed in 2 weeks.

G

8 hours ago, PaBz0r said:

Apparently there is a tripping issue when the AC-Out 1 and 2 share a neutral?  

Well,  AC-out 2 is tied to the input (it's just on the other side of the current sensor), so if you make AC-out-1 and -2 share a neutral it is the same as bridging the neutral on from IN to OUT, which is 1) illegal and 2) will cause the inverter to raise error 11 when it tests its relay.

So don't do that.

4 hours ago, The Terrible Triplett said:

The Multiplus-II is less sensitive I believe. The sensitive Multigrid, not a problem either.

Multiplus-II uses a different method to test the relays and is less prone to tripping RCDs. But EMI filters and surge protectors and things can still cause tiny amounts of surge current when the bonding relay closes and those will trip sensitive RCDs. So in my case I had to 1) cut down on surge-protectors, and 2) I had to install a high-immunity RCD, basically one that is immune to short transients and stops nuisance tripping.

12 hours ago, plonkster said:

Well,  AC-out 2 is tied to the input (it's just on the other side of the current sensor), so if you make AC-out-1 and -2 share a neutral it is the same as bridging the neutral on from IN to OUT, which is 1) illegal and 2) will cause the inverter to raise error 11 when it tests its relay.

So don't do that.

Thanks

Do I need a Victron battery monitor with the Multiplus-II 

 

(Victron MultiPlus II Inverter 48/3000/35-32 230V with a MK3-USB to upgrade firmware
Victron BlueSolar MPPT regulator max 150/35 or 45 or 100 with VE.Direct to USB cable for MPPT (1.8m)
VenusGX
Carlo Gavazzi with RS485 to USB - 5m)

Edited April 3, 20197 yr by Mistral

if wrong one of the guys will kick me.

if you going to use Pylontech, then no as it has a pretty serious onboard management computer already with a data link to your Charge Controller (BlueSolar or SmartSolar MPPT),

if you going to use a "dumb" battery, then yes.

G

Probably looking at Trojans if you guys agree?

Would love lithium's but budget is tight..

If Trojans 6V or 12V - 6V the more popular?