I have acquired the BlueNova 4 kWh Compact Hybrid Kit

It consists of

1 x Axpert MKS Plus 3kVA 2400W 24V Hybrid Inverter.

1 x BlueNova BN26V-154-4k Lithium Ferrous Phosphate Battery.

6 x 260 W Solar Panels. Renewsys Deserv 260W

The supplier provided the sketch below for connecting the components 

According to my calc using pv string tool it cannot work

Comment?

 

1 hour ago, JohanG said:

1 x Axpert MKS Plus 3kVA 2400W 24V Hybrid Inverter.

...

According to my calc using pv string tool it cannot work

There are a lot of 3 kVA 24 V Axperts, with SCCs (Solar Charge Controllers) capable of between 600 and 1500 W. You have plugged in 600 W maximum PV, but that only occurs in the Axpert MKS 3K-24 (and it's a 3 kW model, you state 2.4 kW).

So I'm guessing that the inverter in the package is actually an Axpert MKS 3K-24 Plus, which has a maximum PV input (to the battery) of 1500 W (= 60 A at the battery times 25 V assumed battery voltage). It will actually work well with up to 120% of that, or 1500 x 1.2 = 1800 W. The package has 6 x 260 = 1 560 Wp, which is fine. The worst case cold Voc of 142 V squeaks under the 145 V hard PV max voltage of 145 V.

So I think if you input the correct parameters for the inverter, you'll find it works.

Of course, if you find that they provided an Axpert MKS 3K-24 (without the Plus), then the max PV power (to the battery) is indeed 600 W, and indeed it would not work.

[ Edit: there should be a sticker on the side of the inverter, and it should state the pertinent PV figures (apart from maximum allowed PV power, which Voltronic never seem to get right). ]

[ Edit 2: I note that the diagram omits any kind of protection, presumably for simplicity. But you should have a battery fuse and isolator (could be combined), and PV fuses on each string. ]

[ Edit 3: Oh, and of course the AC output doesn't really have a positive and a negative lead, despite the use of red and black wires. That error seems to be another common one. ]

Edited April 6, 20197 yr by Coulomb

This is the Sticker

 

17 minutes ago, JohanG said:

This is the Sticker

 

That's the 600W model - i.e. not the PLUS model. 

This means that I have been sold short!

31 minutes ago, JohanG said:

This means that I have been sold short!

To add insult to injury ... forgive me ...

 

3 hours ago, JohanG said:

1 x Axpert MKS Plus 3kVA 2400W 24V Hybrid Inverter.

Axpert and Hybrid in the same sentence ... what am I missing if I say that is false advertising?

Axperts are off-grid only.

Edited April 6, 20197 yr by Guest

1 hour ago, The Terrible Triplett said:

To add insult to injury ... forgive me ...

 

Axpert and Hybrid in the same sentence ... what am I missing if I say that is false advertising?

Axperts are off-grid only.

It's seen as Hybrid, albeit not a true one, since it has can take PV and batteries in the same package. 

39 minutes ago, SilverNodashi said:

It's seen as Hybrid, albeit not a true one, since it has can take PV and batteries in the same package. 

O come on!!! 🙂 

6 hours ago, The Terrible Triplett said:

To add insult to injury ... forgive me ...

 

Axpert and Hybrid in the same sentence ... what am I missing if I say that is false advertising?

Axperts are off-grid only.

Are they????

The attachment below is from the manual

and it has an

      AC input 
      AC output 
      PV input 
      Battery input 

Had a rethink ... power is only taken from grid like from the solar and feeds a free standing appliance network no feed back to the utility.

54 minutes ago, JohanG said:

Had a rethink ... power is only taken from grid like from the solar and feeds a free standing appliance network no feed back to the utility.

Yes, it always boils down to the definitions used.

Here is one:
Solar hybrid power systems are hybrid power systems that combine solar power from a photovoltaic system with another power generating energy source. ... The diesel gensets (or Eskom) are used to constantly fill in the gap between the present load and the actual generated power by the PV system.

Here is a second one: https://www.quora.com/What-is-a-hybrid-solar-inverter
Solar hybrid inverter combines the best of traditional on-grid inverter and off-gird inverters to create a revolutionary product which can serve as a one stop shop for energy generation and energy storage. These inverters are economical solutions to enable ‘self-use’ and 'load shifting' of energy. In addition to this, solar hybrid inverters also have Emergency Power Supply (EPS) which offers backup power if your mains utility power fails.

Solar hybrid inverters first use the solar power, and if the demand exceeds the solar power, it imports power from grid. If the solar power exceeds the power demand, the excess power is used to charge batteries. Moreover, if the batteries are fully charged the excess power can be fed back into the grid.

 

Voltronic, when I emailed wanting to buy 10 000 Axpert's and needed paperwork for CoCT (they never reply unless you want to buy) replied stating that Axperts are sold as off-grid solutions.

Titbit. Grid tied hybrid inverter is a grid tied inverter with a battery bank right ... now the battery bank in an CoCT approved hybrid inverter is confusing the cr_p out of CoCT when interpreting their own regulations. 🙂 

9 hours ago, The Terrible Triplett said:

false advertising?

It's incompetence... not malice. Some people don't have their definitions and/or facts straight and will argue high and low that they are right and you are wrong. I also see Victron inverters advertised as off-grid (when technically they are hybrid), and then I see Microcare advertise theirs as bi-directional (which is actually by far the most descriptive term). Lekker confusing.

But yeah... you've got way more PV there than your solar charger is rated for. Take it back and exchange it for the right thing. IMHO... good choice battery, but that's the end of it 🙂

On 2019/04/06 at 10:32 AM, JohanG said:

I have acquired the BlueNova 4 kWh Compact Hybrid Kit

It consists of

1 x Axpert MKS Plus 3kVA 2400W 24V Hybrid Inverter.

1 x BlueNova BN26V-154-4k Lithium Ferrous Phosphate Battery.

6 x 260 W Solar Panels. Renewsys Deserv 260W

The supplier provided the sketch below for connecting the components 

According to my calc using pv string tool it cannot work

Comment?

 

With all the variations and copy and paste I make mistakes and at times do not convey my problem correctly

In this setup there are 6 x 260Watt panels delivering according my calc 10.58v and  16.82A  giving 1860W

The Axpert Model: Axpert MKS 3K-24.can handle 1600W

The solar design tool says no in bold red  ..... is that an emphatic no?

1 hour ago, JohanG said:

In this setup there are 6 x 260Watt panels delivering according my calc 10.58v and  16.82A  giving 1860W

? You can't get 1860 W out of 6 x 260 Wp panels (6 x 260 = 1560), except in very unusual circumstances. The 1860 in your spreadsheet comes from using 310 W panels. I don't know where your 10.58 V would come from; this is way too low for a "24 V" nominal panel. Ah, another typo; that should be 110.58 V. But I don't see where that comes from.

Perhaps you are multiplying Voc by Isc; but these figures are never seen together; they are an open circuit voltage and a short circuit current. You get maximum power at Vmp and Imp.

1 hour ago, JohanG said:

The Axpert Model: Axpert MKS 3K-24.can handle 1600W

Is this another double typo? I thought you were expecting an Axpert MKS 3K-24 Plus, which has a stated "maximum PV array power" of 1500 W. Most unhelpfully, this is merely the maximum dc output current (60 A) times 50 V. So they are telling us the maximum power used by the PV array (ignoring losses, and presuming a 50 V battery), not the maximum nominal power of the array above which the charge controller becomes unstable, which is what a user actually needs to know. Generally, 1.2x to 1.25x the usable power is a good rule of thumb for the maximum array size. So that would be at least 1.2 x 1500 = 1800. So your 6 x 260 W panels would be fine, if you end up with a 1500 W model.

I note that the photo of the sticker above has a maximum solar voltage (Voc) of 75 V. So the cold Voc of 117 V (using Canadian Solar panels) is 156% of what that inverter can handle. That's a definite no-go. Even 101% is a no-go for that figure.

1 hour ago, JohanG said:

The solar design tool says no in bold red  ..... is that an emphatic no?

If you put realistic numbers into the left most column, then yes. But, garbage in, garbage out.

I think the main issue here lies with the Axpert 3kW. Is it a PLUS or not, from what I see on the sticker OP posted it looks like the standard Axpert 3kW 24V PWM. Those are anyway WAY cheaper than the plus, but can only handle low VOC and much lower total PV Watts.

Johan if I were you, I would check in with the supplier on what was expected and what was delivered.

I agree with @Coulomb Regarding the Panels setup, If it is a PLUS, you should be fine with the config as above, If the standard PWM unit, then nope.

R

I must profusely apologize 

Have been chopping and changing between ideas 

The  6 x 260Watt panel: 92.16A 16.94A 1561W (1541w in Solar Design Tool)

Panel specs

Technical Specifications
• Electrical characteristics
• Rated Power, Pmax (Wp) - 260W.
• Voltage at Maximum power, Vmp (V) - 30.72V
• Current at Maximum power, Imp (A) - 8.47A.
• Open circuit voltage, Voc (V) - 38.4V.
• Short Circuit current, lsc (A) - 8.82V.
Module Efficiency (%) - 16.01%.

The Solar Design tool shows red.

As  1561watt Calc > 1500watt spec is this a NO NO

Lastly

the input and time given by you guys are really much appreciated ... I am learning

Thanks

12 hours ago, JohanG said:

1561watt Calc > 1500watt spec is this a NO NO

But my argument is that Voltronic don't provide a figure for the first input into the tool (PV Max (W)). Maybe they are saying that you really can't hook up any more PV power than the charge controller will use. But I believe that up to 120 - 125% extra power is safe. Others are using this with no apparent problems.

So my argument is that the PV Max figure should be 1800 W, which will take away the red no-no.

New day new fact to understand (PV Max (W))

Thanks again