Hi Guys,

I am really confused about which solar inverter to buy as half of the people I talked to say voted for axpert king and other half for infini .I am looking for 5kw inverter for home use during daytime only as I intend to use it WITHOUT batteries.

I live in Pakistan where a company cllaed inverex is rebranding axpert series from voltronic. pls see attached product brochure 

SO which one is better rebranded axpert king vs infini  
also which model of infin like V or E or Plus ???

 

Please advise

 

Thanks

 

Nabeel

Aerox5.2.pdf

1 hour ago, nabeel said:

Hi Guys,

I am really confused about which solar inverter to buy

Welcome to the club 😮

1 hour ago, nabeel said:

I am looking for 5kw inverter for home use during daytime only as I intend to use it WITHOUT batteries.

If you want to use it without batteries, then you need a model with a 450 V Max MPPT; the King is not such a model. The Aerox is a mystery to me; it can't be a rebranded King because the Aerox has a 450 V MPPT, and the King has a 145 V MPPT. Also, the Aerox brochure you attached mentions on-grid operation; none of the Axpert models mentions that (even if we suspect that they use AC coupling internally at times).

1 hour ago, nabeel said:

I live in Pakistan where a company cllaed inverex is rebranding axpert series from voltronic. pls see attached product brochure 

As mentioned above, you attached isn't a rebranded Axpert King. It may be a new Voltronic Power model that is like a King but with the 450 V MPPT, batteryless operation, and on-grid capability. Strange that Voltronic have not announced it, though.

1 hour ago, nabeel said:

SO which one is better rebranded axpert king vs infini  
also which model of infini like V or E or Plus ???

You don't want an Infini V series, because those are 145 V MPPT, and so can't operate without a battery. Sorry, I don't know the Infini models, but it seems that the Infini Super 4K series (possibly no longer manufactured) had significant reliability issues. For example, see Jaco's frustrated post here.

Inverex also re-brand an Axpert VM III, which can operate without a battery, and can blend PV and utility power. There is conflicting information about whether they only carry a 3.2 kW model; this page seems to indicate they have the 5.2 kW model. The extra 0.2 kW and different styling appear to be enhancements requested by Inverex, yet presumably still manufactured by Voltronic Power. They also rebrand one of the 5 kW Infinis, which seems to be able to operate without a battery (in Grid Tie mode).

If you never want to use a battery in the future, you may be better off with a pure grid-tie inverter. One is mentioned frequently on these forums; I can't recall the brand just now, but it seems to be recommended.

I think the 5KW infini (not the V series) is a better option due to the fact that it is dual MPPT. But of course the price difference between the Aerox and the Infini is too much. If you're only wanting to use it during daytime and without batteries do look into the Solis 5KW Inverter. It will cost you about the same as an Aerox but it has a greater MPPT range and also features dual MPPT. Specs wise it seems good. A friend of mine got the Solis for his 10KW home setup.

just checked the specs again from voltronic website

inifini 5kw E(Enhanced) with 2 mppt trackers  has MPPT voltage range  150 - 450V DC

5kw V series   60 - 115V DC

infinisolar puls 5kw   250 - 850V DC

"You don't want an Infini V series, because those are 145 V MPPT, and so can't operate without a battery""

just curious what is the reason behind that .. if you can please shed some light for better understanding 

 

Many Thanks

 

56 minutes ago, nabeel said:

what is the reason behind that

Just an observation; I didn't design them 🤓. It's probably because the path from panels to load with the 145 V MPPT is:

buckMPPT → DC-DC (two full-bridge converters) → inverter (4 stages)

versus with the 450 V MPPT:

boostMPPT → inverter (2 stages)

Hi @nabeel

InfiniSolar

I have two InfiniSolar 5K Plus, in the off-grid mode and these are great machines. I really like the dual MPPT inputs, so one can connect 10KW of PV panels to a single 5KW inverter. Especially in the winter, this feature is a killer.

On the other hand, there are some drawbacks too:

• InfiniSolar 5K Plus is an expensive machine, costs approximatelly 3x the price of an Axpert
• has quite a big self-consumption
• features a slot for LAN card with the webGUI, but has no Bluetooth etc.

While InfiniSolar 5K Plus can operate without batteries, it makes no sense to buy such an expensive machine and then end up not using a half of it's capabilities. There are other models in the line, which I can recommend: InfiniSolar 3K Plus and InfiniSolar 10KW 3P (3-phase). But I would suggest you to stay away from InfiniSolar V, E, and Super as these are circumcised, low-cost (aka Value) models.

 

Inverex Aerox 5.2KW

This machine is custom built for Inverex and it's NOT similar to any other inverter from the Voltronic production line. While normal Axpert inverters are off-grid, the Inverex Aerox 5.2 is a HYBRID machine and as such it has the capability of feeding electricity back to the grid. It's definitely NOT Axpert King. I have no experience with Inverex, but looking into the product manual and knowing that the Inverex is a well-know brand in the Pakistan, I would say that this inverter might be a good choice for you. Just doublecheck with the seller that it can really run without batteries (product manual says it can). Another thing to check is whether your municipality will be okay if you will feed excess electricity to the grid. There might be some paperwork associated with it.

 

5 hours ago, Youda said:

Hi @nabeel

InfiniSolar

I have two InfiniSolar 5K Plus, in the off-grid mode and these are great machines. I really like the dual MPPT inputs, so one can connect 10KW of PV panels to a single 5KW inverter. Especially in the winter, this feature is a killer.

On the other hand, there are some drawbacks too:

• InfiniSolar 5K Plus is an expensive machine, costs approximatelly 3x the price of an Axpert
• has quite a big self-consumption
• features a slot for LAN card with the webGUI, but has no Bluetooth etc.

While InfiniSolar 5K Plus can operate without batteries, it makes no sense to buy such an expensive machine and then end up not using a half of it's capabilities. There are other models in the line, which I can recommend: InfiniSolar 3K Plus and InfiniSolar 10KW 3P (3-phase). But I would suggest you to stay away from InfiniSolar V, E, and Super as these are circumcised, low-cost (aka Value) models.

 

Inverex Aerox 5.2KW

This machine is custom built for Inverex and it's NOT similar to any other inverter from the Voltronic production line. While normal Axpert inverters are off-grid, the Inverex Aerox 5.2 is a HYBRID machine and as such it has the capability of feeding electricity back to the grid. It's definitely NOT Axpert King. I have no experience with Inverex, but looking into the product manual and knowing that the Inverex is a well-know brand in the Pakistan, I would say that this inverter might be a good choice for you. Just doublecheck with the seller that it can really run without batteries (product manual says it can). Another thing to check is whether your municipality will be okay if you will feed excess electricity to the grid. There might be some paperwork associated with it.

 

Keen to know more about self consumption on the 5kw plus... Does it draw this from battery ? If so how long and how much does it use for self consumption alone ? I was looking at purchase this but was skeptical 

8 hours ago, Treschen said:

Does it draw this from battery ?

The Infinis / InfiniSolars have many power converters, so idle consumption can come from either of the three power sources: battery, PV, or utility. There are many modes to determine which source is used at any one time, given the supply and demand at any instant.

For the Infini 5K Plus, it's about 125W just to keep the box running.

Most of my experience is based on running it in the off-grid mode: 

During the day, the idle consumption is being covered from PV. Overnight it draws this from the battery. If the grid is available, Infini draws 2W from it.

Even if you do bypass, so the loads are fed from the grid, there's still about 25W draw from the battery.

Long story short, Infini needs a decent PV array and huge batteries in order to serve you well. Depending on the use case a GoodWe hybrid might be a better alternative, for example. For the off-grid installations, Victron or Axpert is a good choice.

 

AFAIK, in the grid-tie with backup mode, overnight idle consumption draws from the grid, but there still some small load on the battery too. It's never a true zero.

Can anybody share his experience with this mode, please?

Hi @Youda

Thanks for the info .seems like you have inside info about inverex models. just curious are you based in Pakistan or have some contacts in Inverex.?

Yes the aerox 5.2kw has specs similar to axpert 5.2kw except the 0msec transfer time claim which is the property of axpert king.SO it seems a mix of both .

SO far almost nobody i talked to is running their aerox without batteries so was hoping to get user feedback about its batteryless operation specially for running 1800BTU 

Air conditioners.

These customized axpert models come under low cost inverters according to voltronic website while infini is considered true grid tied inverter

Inverex is offereing 5 year warranty for their aerox models while for infini they are offering one year 

Nope, I'm based in Europe. I have a lot of experience fiddling with InfiniSolars and Axperts, that's why I can compare.

Inverex is not being sold here, but I had a few conversations with Inverex users in the past, so I learned that it's a reputable brand in Pakistan and the guts are 90% similar with Voltronic Axpert. Also learned that Inverex models are highly customized - for example, they can accomodate higher fluctuation on AC input, always have 200W higher output rating then similar Axperts. Also, the Inverex is the only brand that uses the custom-build casing and custom display. All other vendors selling OEM Voltronic stuff are using standard displays and casing, just change the color of the display's backlight and the box to red, green, yellow...

Personally, I like InfiniSolar, and I'm convinced that it's a good machine. But for you, InfiniSolar is an overkill.

BTW: What's the power consumption of that digital AirCondition that you want to feed with solar? 1000W? If so, it will run like a breeze with 5.2KW inverter.

Edited June 3, 20197 yr by Youda

Thanks @Youda

would like to learn more about your experience.

The two inverter based Airconditioners are 1500 watt each and as you might know after about 30 mins of operation they come down to about 600 watt each

so in theory yea aerox would suit me but i havent seen anyone using it the way i want to use it.(without batteries)

I am bit skeptical about its live load sharing feature in SUB priority setting .There can be a number of scenarios which it will have to cover and very quickly like under 10 or 20 msec without any flicker or delay and without damaging the compressor of the AC in the long run

 

Edited June 3, 20197 yr by nabeel

Check out this video for Aerox 5.2KW test with non-inverter AC without any battery or grid connection.

 

13 hours ago, bluwater said:

Check out this video for Aerox 5.2KW test with non-inverter AC without any battery or grid connection.

 

Yep seen that before just shows its possible. so all i want is to listen to user who have used it for long term 

 

On 2019/06/04 at 11:27 AM, nabeel said:

Yep seen that before just shows its possible. so all i want is to listen to user who have used it for long term 

 

I've been using it for a couple of months now without battery with all major home appliances. No issue if you have stable supply and can manage load in case of power outage. What I have observed, probably all inverters work this way without battery, is that in case of power failure, if inverter is highly loaded, voltage drops considerably, around190-200v before overloading/tripping. If inverter is offloaded, voltage stabilizes. I too am now considering to install a battery bank to avoid this issue.

Anyone suggest me which inverter is betterto install solis 25kw or voltronics 10kw with 3 parallel unit for only day time use for 3phase supply