Steve87

@Aartappel your problem is quite a generic one and I have seen a few different solutions that the farming community is deploying...Direct Solar panels on VFDs, some farmers creating micro Grids large in size and then installing their own MV transmission lines and then disconnecting the various Eskom incomer points. I have at least 3 users completed these projects & have done it in a staged approach but the savings and the benefits are there to witness. Those unreliable expensive Eskom points are worth shutting down & pocketing the ongoing costs into your own infrastructure. I have been involved with especially ATESS and more recently over the last 2 yrs Megarevo Transformer based Hybrids and AC coupled Grid ties and DC coupled ATESS topology. The largest plant at 1.5MW carrying a base load of 700kW is in a factory with massive HVAC and high inductive loads. The Atess equipment is really robust and honestly can take a heavy punch with large motors starting and stopping... Its just my personal opinion that the High frequency non transformer based inverters won't last long for the irrigation environment or SAs farming environment because we have harsh conditions and we require equipment that will last the next decade that is serviceable in the field. If you need basic advice and user cases please PM me. I can definitely point you in the right direction as well as share plants with you that have proven themselves in the field. The farming community are ripe to reap the rewards of solar power & with Diesel pricing very volatile id imagine it's going to accelerate...

Honestly it doesn't get better than this. Anything else will be a new product from the Factory. Lowest cell at 3.47 is very close to a full cell. This type of top float balancing can even be done once a week. In the high end Commercial installations these batteries carry out 2 Cycles a day due to 2 peaks (morning and evening) and once a week keeps them in good shape.

Must say that pack is pretty well balanced. I regard the Felicity battery quite highly. I have only seen good things in the examples I have seen in the field. The situation is exaggerated as @TaliaB has noted. LFP stretches it's legs at the top and the bottom of the charge curve. An active balancer as fitted to Orion's on the FW keeps pack in synch and you don't see this level of delta. But the passive (ghandi) balancer takes time and strategy in keeping it floating slowly towards 100% SoC. Still effective but every OEM has a different strategy. So it takes time to learn what the OEM wants and then to practice it at least once a week to keep things healthy.

Very long story about the 5kWh Pace BMS FreedomWon E tower and the rest of the lite family. The E tower is exclusively made and assembled in China. The Lite family is assembled and made under FW factory here in SA. All Lites and Lite 2 have Orion BMS Jr for LV and Orion & Orion 2 for the HV units. The Orion has massive pedigree and is made in the USA. It's a delight to work with because it's in good English and for a skilled operator can allow some pretty radical stuff. There is a password protecting the nitty gritty for good reason. In the wrong hands can cause some harm. Of particular interest the Orion HV is an adaptation from the EV market in the US and hence the price if you are looking to source one can be north of R100k. It's a BMS that can harness individually to all +200s cells and features Active balancing. So pretty special one big monster unit. The Chinese EV market adaptation is slightly different topology. They have a Modular way of BMS control. A BAU in some cases , BCU and BMU. Modular making it significantly cheaper if anything fails. Each can be around R30k to R5k depending on the module. Some useless info but must say very intriguing to be exposed to both topologies and to each their own. I see good benefits on both sides of the fence.

Then divide that number by 2 to extract the cycle count FW makes use of...

Anyone looking for someone reputable in the Gauteng area, please call Gideon :+27 82 905 0773. I have worked alongside him on quite a few interesting projects. A very good operator.

Some other finer points to consider is to make sure you have a Submersible pump that is rated at the depths of water that you trying to pump from. I just needed someone to drill the hole and I opted to size and purchase the pumps myself as I knew there is a lot of bullshittery when it comes to this. My home is double story so I opted for 1.2kW Booster pump. My submersible is a 750W Pump and I opted for Hurricane Pumps as they based in Centurion. Really helpful people and had good knowledge for beginners like me. They even had installers if I required. My Submersible is rated for 100m depth so 60m is not too far a stretch for it's operation. A lot of people will want the Rolls Royce of DAB pumps but that's maybe a Sunsynk Vs Axpert argument. All I can say is that I have a 12month warranty on both pumps and whilst I was there, there was a person that came in with a warranty claim and a brand new pump was exchanged. Pump was in operation for 3 months. They asked a few questions to ascertain if there was an installation issue but there was a willingness to assist rather than refute. My rig has been running for 6months now and hasn't skipped a beat. We use the water for all of our needs not just limited to irrigation and pool. Municipal supply is shut off and for that matter electrical supply too. Good luck guys it's not easy just like the solar industry isn't easy to find competent and reputable people but doing your homework can get good results. Just like solar you spending good money so the same rules apply dedicate some good time to review the subject.

Having done this recently in my home...The following points are noteworthy from my limited experience: 1) Take note to use a quality submersible cable and thickness. 2) Rate the size of your submersible pump correctly. 3) Take note when they are drilling to know at what depth you first find water. 4) Try to have margin with how deep you go and take note of the season. In wet season the water table can be higher than in the dryer months so give yourself margin and go to a lower depth if possible. 5) Case the Hole to deeper depths if possible and affordable. Points 1 - 4 can be the causes of the pumps not working. Also make use of quality thick wall Class 16 HDPE pipe it's more heavy duty with thicker Walls and won't perish or cut during installation. I wired and dropped my own pump and wired everything myself without an assistant. My depth is 60m and we had a very poor soil formation of Clay down to 25m. We cased in Metal to 30m and then cased in 8mm Blue PVC to 60m. We discovered water at 18m. Did a yield test and ran for 5 hours at a rate of 4500l per hour and tested recovery. I installed a 3000l per hour Pump and I fill up my 5000l tank in +-50mins. Ok given I had a poor formation forced me to take precautions of casing all the way down to my 60m depth but the hole is very strong and the water quality is amazing. I think the same rules apply here guys, get a good reputable company with some word of mouth reviews that will send an approved person to locate water and do a site survey before they drill. If you in Gauteng and need a competent drilling company call: Top line Borehole Drilling: +27 83 296 5917. I got in touch with them through word of mouth and I did not regret it neither has their former clients that refered me.

Hi Brad, you have accessed it well. In order to create a Micro Grid ie. Have Grid tie inverters connected to the load output of Large Hybrid inverters you need an Energy meter to carry out the Measurements of what the Grid ties and or Load is doing. That Energy meter allows us to via Modbus send production throttle commands to the Grid tie inverters. I have used most brands and they operate on the same principles. When the Grid ties produce more than the load, the power is exported into the LOAD port into the inverter. The inverter will suck up that energy into the battery and charge up. When we reach 95% we Throttle the Grid ties to follow the load only (Zero Export). We have successfully added our EMS controller into many of these control scenarios with very good results. Please send me a PM if you want to discuss further or have a project requirement. This is a niche market and there are probably a handful of operators and EMS creators that can achieve this. I'm proud to say my company is one of them. Further to that of the handful only 4 of these companies are local and once again proud to be one of the local EMS producers finding solutions for large Commercial Solar Plants ...

Hi @Multiwatt thanks for your post. We have created our own EMS & can control Grid Tie inverters using the help of an energy meter & CTs. We do not frequency shift we merely control the Grid tie via Modbus RTU/ TCP commands based on ESS % SOC.

Please share your thoughts would enlighten a lot of us here...

If it helps Zola I have a Frankenstein operation at my place. One is the same as yours 10/8 by FreedomWon, another is a repaired Livoltek 5kWh and the last one is 6kWh LFP DIY pack. The SoCs actually stay within 5% of each other and I use comms to the available 10/8 and because they so close its a good indicator for bank SoC. But @Youda speaks wise words they must be the same cell count ie only 51.2V can pair with 51.2v & 48V to 48v anything different and you looking for trouble because the charge settings of these 2 arrangements is widely different.

One can add larger panels rated at higher amps but there will big losses. So yes it will work but the panel will never reach its rated wattage quite simply because the MPPT is not designed for such a panel. In the early days of Grid tie inverters they had the same issues with their 11A rated strings into the MPPT. That is one of the reasons the Solis S6 is such a good prospect for the residential market. However, one must note it's the latest addition and new comer so it definitely has to have better technology. If we had a new generation Deye 5kW it would no doubt have the wider voltage band and current specs. I don't see Deye or Sunsynk spending money for that it makes no sense. There are bigger fish to fry...

Hi hope I don't qualify as a "bakkie-brigader" however, I think this article may have a good intention but the explanation is a bit inaccurate. I have seen this arguement being had a lot and once again it's a little lack of what is the actual risk. What is risky here ? The MPPTs are a DC driven device. It extracts power by the product of Voltage and Amps. What is the limitation to observe the Volts or the amps and what happens to either if you exceed them?? The MPPT will have a 500V max voltage for example. If you go and connect enough panels in series like 10 in series at 52V per panel (520V) you will exceed the raw voltage input & the MPPT can be damaged. Let's say there is a amperage total expressed as 11A on the MPPT. What happens if I use a 550W JA Mono panel rated at 52V per panel Voc and Imp at 14A. What will happen to a string length of 8 panels?? A lot of ppl and probably the author of that article believes that we ok in the Voltage range because 52V x 8panels = 416V total. So voltage is GOOD. What about the current? They believe the MPPt will blow and get damaged because the panels at Max power current will deliver 14A and fry the MPPT. This is grossly incorrect!! The MPPT will drink 11A from the panels because that's all it needs. It won't kill itself trying to get drunk. If someone including this author feels anything differently let's try to compare logic if not science. You have a 5kWh or 100ah battery attached to this same inverter. It's rated battery max input current draw is 100A. If I attached another 5kWh (100ah) battery to this is parallel what will happen?? Everyone knows the inverter doesn't blow up. However if you connect them in series to get 100V you have a problem and will damage the inverter. Some ppl mock the humble Bakkie Brigader, however, there are some basic fundamentals that need to be understood before we point fingers. Now we can argue further that there will be losses with the 550W panel because it will never reach full rated power and I agree with that. The 460W panel is a better fit because it has 11A Imp rating. But let's just say the message to pass on is that poorly integrated equipment can cause damage and losses in production but the fear mongering of ppl saying the amps will damage the MPPTs is just a camp fire story. Sorry to be a pain but even an electrical engineer at a Multi million rand project wanted me to connect an Atess inverter at 1100V. The max MPPT voltage is 1000V and the MPPT range is 450V to 800V. I was carrying out the commissioning & I refused. So the moral of this story is that Solar is a relatively new technology and a lot of operators/ installers/ electrical engineers/ Bakkie Brigaders and plumbers know what they are doing and a lot don't know. I couldn't care less the title of the person, we don't all know the same things neither do we have the same experience levels.

Eish my friend, long time no see 🙈

They are a nightmare to deal with & try at every corner to tell you: you are dumb you blew the thing up. What a mess.

Your guys warranty is still intact, it's just not serviced by Herholtds anymore, it's now the responsibility of Sunsynk in Randburg. So the service centre in Randburg is now your first point of call. SigEnergy has a lot to do with this happening. I can't comment beyond: it doesn't help to rubbish another equipment supplier based on the new kid on the block product. A product is only good as the time it has spent in the field. Our Eskom power Grid is the R&D testing ground of a lot of these Chinese OEMs. Let's see how the new kid on the block performs. However, a bridge has been burnt, I hope it goes well.

Energy storage is just potential energy. You won't exceed anything on the inverter. It's like hooking up batteries in parallel to your motor car, you car would still just use what it needs from the battery. The inverter is the same, you are adding potential energy that can be used by the inverter whenever it needs it. Maybe another simple explanation is fuel inside your cars fuel tank. You can add an extra external fuel tank & that means you car can travel further but it won't damage the engine in any way.

Keep us posted, there are quite few guys battery building & some guys that will add some great value. The first time you connect the battery & it produces power, that rewarding feeling is what is addictive.

So you need to decide whether you subscribe to compression or not. Me personally I don't subscribe to it. I can't convince you, it's a personal choice, do the research & do what is comfortable for you. Setup the cells in a long parallel stack using the busbars, set your charger to 3.60V & set 10A. Some guys go as high as 3.65V personally I don't think it's necessary, 3.6V is as good as it gets for me. When the charger reaches 0A you know your cells are all top balanced. Now you can begin your battery assembly starting with good knowledge that they are all at the same SOC. Now 10A over a stacked Parallel set of 15 or 16 cells can take a long time to charge. Because that's 100ah x 16 or 15 cells so you might need to let this charge a good few days depending on the individual SoCs. Also make sure you place you charger + & - on opposite ends of the parallel stack, so that energy is traveling directly through the entire bank, not via individual cell transfer. Your 10A charger can take long & that is why I prefer the 40A charger it just goes 4 times faster & can also give me cycle data on the cell, but what you have there will definitely be good enough to do the job. Enjoy the build if it's your first time: be careful it's becomes addictive !!

This is the variable up to 5V & 40A charger. I don't know of other ways maybe some other guys can step in & comment but I don't know another way to top balance without this equipment.

Ideally you need a DC variable power supply. I have 2 different chargers. One is variable voltage up to 5V but high amperage & one that is variable to 60V at low amps 5amps. Just placing them in parallel without a charge will not do anything.

I would definitely go the full way & Top balance, the voltage tells you absolutely nothing about the SoC of each cell. Will also save you a lot of hassles because it will be your Quality control that when you assemble your pack you know they all started at the same SoC...

I would look to add a Transformer based Inverter for this application. I have worked in the C&I market & have seen on one particular site with a very large walk in Cold room that compressor generate high surge cold start currents. The Gate & Drive Sunsynks & Deyes have their place in the market & that's usually when there is no heavy inductive loads, however, when you start playing with factory or industrial equipment like compressors & motors the application needs to be specified accordingly. Otherwise you run the risk of your solution not working. I would recommend equipment like the ATESS HPS range or Megarevo MPS range depending on your power requirement. They are High Voltage machines & are built for industrial applications with in built isolation transformers. However, I would first start with a power investigation with a Logger or meter to find out your power peaks & requirements followed by matching the inverter output current to at the very least to match your Grid input breaker. These projects often cost a lot of money, so due diligence must be followed with planning, selection of equipment, installation execution as well as plant management (operations & maintenance).

This is what separates the Cowboys from the real proper operators...