On 2022/12/17 at 1:14 PM, JayLie said:

I wonder if anyone have the perfect charging and float voltages for me, I'm using a Axpert inverter, and Shoto SDA10-48100 Lithium Battery 5.1kWh (16cell) battery

if i remeber corrctly the shoto manual recommends 54.6  and 52.5 i think which equates per cell to 3.65 charge and float 3.5

though  i opted for different since i noted my inverter tends to run a bit higher than settings at times and mine is a 15s config

so i opted for 3.55 x 15s 53.5v but my inverter makes a turn at 54v for charging

and naturallly 3.45 x 15s 51.7 for my float since from what i can see from spec sheets of cells 3.45 resting is 100% soc

 

3 minutes ago, Leondavibe said:

if i remeber corrctly the shoto manual recommends 54.6  and 52.5 i think which equates per cell to 3.65 charge and float 3.5

though  i opted for different since i noted my inverter tends to run a bit higher than settings at times and mine is a 15s config

so i opted for 3.55 x 15s 53.5v but my inverter makes a turn at 54v for charging

and naturallly 3.45 x 15s 51.7 for my float since from what i can see from spec sheets of cells 3.45 resting is 100% soc

 

i'm using what i believe to be an axpert clone synerji and shoto sda10-48100m14 opened it up to confirm 15S and later when i got the pc connection working software showed the same

Sorry perhaps silly question, but I need clarification on this: are CAN and RS485 comms an either or option or can both be utilized at same time for different purposes?

Specifically for my case I already have my 2x Shoto batteries hooked up via CAN to SunSynk inverter for BMS control purposes. Master battery is on dip 5 with CAN cable to inverter and slave battery on dip 1 with cable between RS485B of master and RS485A on slave. 

If I were to hookup something via RS485(A), on master battery, to USB will I then loose existing CAN comms to inverter as its my understanding the dip switches etc also needs to be changed?

What I'm trying to achieve is retain my existing Inverter<->CAN<->BMS comms/control and additionally read of more temp and cell voltage readings, etc of from RS485.

8 hours ago, jgdt said:

What I'm trying to achieve is retain my existing Inverter<->CAN<->BMS comms/control and additionally read of more temp and cell voltage readings, etc of from RS485.

This should work just fine if you connect to the RS485A port on the master and use a RS485-USB adapter. You shouldn't lose the CAN comms. This is what that port is designed for so you don't need to break the comms to the inverter if you want to read info from the bank via a PC. The batteries are always using RS485 to communicate to each other.

I think there is some confusion around being able to use RS485 to the inverter at all. These batteries only allow CAN communication to the inverter, but newer versions of the seplos bms do have the option to use RS485, but it is via the same port marked CAN and uses what they call RM485, but that hardware is not in these batteries as far as I have seen.

If there is anyone out there who has working RS485 comms between the battery and inverter, please let us know, I would be very interested.

 

15 hours ago, jumper said:

should work just fine if you connect to the RS485A port on the master and use a RS485-USB adapter. You shouldn't lose the CAN comms.

Ah great @jumper, thanks for the explanation. This sounds very positive.

Has anybody used the Solar Assistant Shoto cable (https://solar-assistant.io/shop/products/shoto) successfully with PC based tools like Battery Monitor, PBMSTools, PModBusToos, etc. Or will this cable only work with the Solar Assistant Rasberry Pi?

The said cable is a bit pricy. What's the total cost of rolling your own cable in line with the pint outs in page 1 of this thread if you need to buy all the components and tools (like a crimper, etc).

9 minutes ago, jgdt said:

Ah great @jumper, thanks for the explanation. This sounds very positive.

Has anybody used the Solar Assistant Shoto cable (https://solar-assistant.io/shop/products/shoto) successfully with PC based tools like Battery Monitor, PBMSTools, PModBusToos, etc. Or will this cable only work with the Solar Assistant Rasberry Pi?

The said cable is a bit pricy. What's the total cost of rolling your own cable in line with the pint outs in page 1 of this thread if you need to buy all the components and tools (like a crimper, etc).

The SA cable will work for everything, but you can make your own really cheaply like I did with an old lan cable and a RS485-USB adapter for R30. Just cut the cable and attach 2 wires to the adapter, no crimper necessary.

1 hour ago, jumper said:

RS485-USB adapter for R30

Thanks Jumper. Where can I get the adapters for R30? My limited googling only got hits for couple of hundred bokke.

7 minutes ago, jgdt said:

Thanks Jumper. Where can I get the adapters for R30? My limited googling only got hits for couple of hundred bokke.

I bought this one, but I see they are out of stock: https://www.robotics.org.za/RS485-MINI

If you can find the same one somewhere else it will work, you only need 2 wires.

2 hours ago, jumper said:

out of stock: https://www.robotics.org.za/RS485-MINI

Thanks Jumper. I found something similar here (and ordered already): https://www.pishop.co.za/store/usb-to-rs485-485-converter-adapter . To my untrained eye they look to be the same. Hope it works.

18 hours ago, jgdt said:

Thanks Jumper. I found something similar here (and ordered already): https://www.pishop.co.za/store/usb-to-rs485-485-converter-adapter . To my untrained eye they look to be the same. Hope it works.

That looks exactly the same. Should work. Just let windows install the drivers.

On 2023/03/06 at 8:08 AM, jumper said:

That looks exactly the same. Should work. Just let windows install the drivers.

Just received my adapter. I plugged it into an old windows 7 laptop (previously there was mentions of win 10/11 uses, but there are resolution steps in this thread) just to have fewer technical hurdles to get it going first. The adaptor is "unconnected" at this point in time, will strip an old LAN cable later and connect it according to the pin outs already provided.

I "allowed" windows to install a driver for me and it seems to have installed a USB-SERIAL CH340 driver. See attached photo. Just want to list this so long as I think Jumper did mention that in his case this driver was not the right one (even tough the CH340 is listed on his buying page : https://www.robotics.org.za/RS485-MINI?search=usb rs485

Hope I'm still on the right path, next I'll install Battery Monitor as per the documents on the google drive link in this thread. Do I need to have the cable connected to battery's RS458A when doing the installation or can installation be done with no connection and then just add it later?

Okay, so I made my cable according to the noted pin out in this thread (same as pin out in installation diagrams) and I confirmed there's continuity via multimeter, so I assume wiring is okay.

I installed Battery Monitor 2.1.8 following the installation guide and imported the 'BMS-16S' protocol. It does pick up my COM3 port (its available in the port num drop down) and I changed baud rate to 19200, but after clicking connect it just sits with 'connecting...' dialogue spinner. Afterwards I tried V2.1.9 following same steps, but same undesired result. I did check the number format region settings as well.

Are there any logs I can reference to troubleshoot?

Are there other com port sniffers I can use just to verify that something is coming out of the RS485A port on my master battery?

5 hours ago, jgdt said:

I "allowed" windows to install a driver for me and it seems to have installed a USB-SERIAL CH340 driver. See attached photo. Just want to list this so long as I think Jumper did mention that in his case this driver was not the right one (even tough the CH340 is listed on his buying page : https://www.robotics.org.za/RS485-MINI?search=usb rs485

Yeah the website says it is CH340, but that driver didn't work for me, it turned out to be FTDI in the end which is better. I had to uninstall all the drivers and manually delete them from their windows folders and then it worked with the FTDI driver. I'm on WIN10.

4 hours ago, jgdt said:

Are there other com port sniffers I can use just to verify that something is coming out of the RS485A port on my master battery?

I tried device monitoring studio when I was troubleshooting and that actually caused driver problems too as the software added it's own driver files, I had to remove it for the device to work.

12 hours ago, jumper said:

worked with the FTDI driver

Are you specifically referring to the FTDI driver install under https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/19uXOdmnqQoSb-akqRYanMFJ1uQha8XvM
Or should I google around to find the latest FTDI driver or rather the specific one that applies to my adapter?

@jumper would you perhaps be so kind as to open your adaptor and inspect the chips for markings? Mine is printed in a grey color and very small so only noticed it ones I've used a flash light. Its marked as "WCH CH340C 411406C11". Hoping the CH340 driver should then be the one?

I've tried both the FTDI and CH340 drivers (always making sure I do a clean install) as well as old and latest versions,  no success. With CH340 drivers I at least can see data in serial com sniffer, but not with FTDI.

Is there perhaps a newer version of Battery Monitor out there that I can try? I tried both 2.1.8 and 2.1.9. Perhaps if I use the latest Battery Monitor and latest CH340 driver I might have more success?

Edited March 8, 20233 yr by jgdt

4 hours ago, jgdt said:

@jumper would you perhaps be so kind as to open your adaptor and inspect the chips for markings?

Unfortunately I can't, I have heatshrink over it to strengthen the join to the wires. If it says CH340 on it then it must be CH340. I read that the CH340 chips don't work so well which is why I had given up on mine but saw someone else get it working on another battery so I gave it another try. If you see data with the CH340 driver and not the FTDI then I guess it is CH340.

4 hours ago, jgdt said:

Is there perhaps a newer version of Battery Monitor out there that I can try? I tried both 2.1.8 and 2.1.9. Perhaps if I use the latest Battery Monitor and latest CH340 driver I might have more success?

2.1.8 was the only version around when I bought my battery and it works so I've not tried anything else. I think 2.1.9 is the latest. The CH340 chips and drivers are older than the FTDI so it should work with 2.1.8 if it is going to.

Sorry I can't help any further as I don't have experience of a working CH340 adapter, so I can't say for sure if it will work or not.

7 hours ago, jgdt said:

Are you specifically referring to the FTDI driver install under https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/19uXOdmnqQoSb-akqRYanMFJ1uQha8XvM
Or should I google around to find the latest FTDI driver or rather the specific one that applies to my adapter?

I've never seen those drivers, but I see in the remark that the driver is for the seplos adapter so probably won't work for yours. I think I did the driver install via the device manager in windows and searched for the ftdi driver there, it was months ago and I tried so many different things that I can't recall exactly. I do remember that it was necessary to remove the old drivers from the windows folder before installing the new ones as they were still lying there after the uninstall.

Here are the drivers that work for mine, installed via windows:

Remove any other driver files as they might cause confilcts.

Edited March 8, 20233 yr by jumper

12 hours ago, jumper said:

Remove any other driver files as they might cause confilcts.

Thanks, I'll take a deeper look into the drivers today, especially cleanup and try it on a cleaner machine as well. Can you please confirm the exact make/model of your batteries where you got this to work - is it Shoto SDC10-Box 5 or something else that also uses Seplos BMS?

Thanks for all the assistance.

1 hour ago, jgdt said:

Thanks, I'll take a deeper look into the drivers today, especially cleanup and try it on a cleaner machine as well. Can you please confirm the exact make/model of your batteries where you got this to work - is it Shoto SDC10-Box 5 or something else that also uses Seplos BMS?

Thanks for all the assistance.

I have the Shoto SDA10-48100 5.12kWh (16S) which looks identical to the SDC10, just that it is rack mounted instead of stacked. I'm pretty sure they will use the same seplos BMS.

P.S. I just checked the manual you uploaded and it is almost exactly the same. Pinouts etc. are identical. The only difference I see is that the SDC10 is 80% DOD whereas the SDA-10 is 90% DOD.

P.P.S Looking closer I see that the SDC10 is also rack mountable, the housing is identical to the SDA-10 and I also see it advertised as 90% DOD... seems like the same battery to me.

Edited March 9, 20233 yr by jumper

Drivers:

I've cleaned up my drivers and can confirm that in my case the CH340 drivers should be used. Like jumper said, obviously because mine is a CH340 chip and not the better FTDI chip. The version itself does not matter. The version windows installs automatically is fine or the latest downloaded or even the one the google drive link (which I assume came from here https://www.seplos.com/en/download.html?group_id=6318).

Progress:

My problem, it seems, is that when just clicking connect (granted com port and baud rate is correctly set) the Battery Monitor software only tries to connect to Pack00. Which in my case is unsuccessful. If I additionally toggle 'Pack 1' in the Target config section, before hitting connect, it successfully connects. But,... only to Pack01. Pack00 is still missing.

Cables and setup:

- Slave battery: Dips 1 on, rest off. Cable from RS485A to master battery's RS485B port.

- Master battery: Dips 5 on, rest off for CAN comms to inverter (cable between CAN port on battery and CAN port on inverter). Additionally it contains the new cable from RS485A to USB/PC.

Pack assumptions:

I think Pack01, as picked up by Battery Monitor, is the slave battery and presumably then my master battery is suppose to be Pack00.

If I disconnect the inter battery comms cable between master and slave then Battery Monitor can't pick up anything. Which make sense because master battery isn't getting anything from slave battery anymore. If I then move my RS485A-USB/PC cable to the slave battery then Battery Monitor picks up Pack01 again, and the values seems to be the same than before.

Going forward:

So why isn't it picking up my master battery, presumably Pack00?

Is it because master dips are set to 5 for CAN comms to inverter? I guess as a test I can toggle dips for RS485 alone setup and reset battery, but feels risky. I don't want to find myself in a place where I can't revert back (for whatever reason) to the CAN comms to inverter.

So this brings me back to my original question can the master battery talk CAN to inverter and RS485 to USB/PC at the same time? 

 

8 minutes ago, jgdt said:

Drivers:

I've cleaned up my drivers and can confirm that in my case the CH340 drivers should be used. Like jumper said, obviously because mine is a CH340 chip and not the better FTDI chip. The version itself does not matter. The version windows installs automatically is fine or the latest downloaded or even the one the google drive link (which I assume came from here https://www.seplos.com/en/download.html?group_id=6318).

Progress:

My problem, it seems, is that when just clicking connect (granted com port and baud rate is correctly set) the Battery Monitor software only tries to connect to Pack00. Which in my case is unsuccessful. If I additionally toggle 'Pack 1' in the Target config section, before hitting connect, it successfully connects. But,... only to Pack01. Pack00 is still missing.

Cables and setup:

- Slave battery: Dips 1 on, rest off. Cable from RS485A to master battery's RS485B port.

- Master battery: Dips 5 on, rest off for CAN comms to inverter (cable between CAN port on battery and CAN port on inverter). Additionally it contains the new cable from RS485A to USB/PC.

Pack assumptions:

I think Pack01, as picked up by Battery Monitor, is the slave battery and presumably then my master battery is suppose to be Pack00.

If I disconnect the inter battery comms cable between master and slave then Battery Monitor can't pick up anything. Which make sense because master battery isn't getting anything from slave battery anymore. If I then move my RS485A-USB/PC cable to the slave battery then Battery Monitor picks up Pack01 again, and the values seems to be the same than before.

Going forward:

So why isn't it picking up my master battery, presumably Pack00?

Is it because master dips are set to 5 for CAN comms to inverter? I guess as a test I can toggle dips for RS485 alone setup and reset battery, but feels risky. I don't want to find myself in a place where I can't revert back (for whatever reason) to the CAN comms to inverter.

So this brings me back to my original question can the master battery talk CAN to inverter and RS485 to USB/PC at the same time? 

 

Just be careful, from what is posted above you are overcharging your battery to the point that the BMS cut out all charging. 

19 minutes ago, Antonio de Sa said:

Just be careful, from what is posted above you are overcharging your battery to the point that the BMS cut out all charging.

Yeah I noticed that and its concerning. My batteries just hit SOC 100% at the time of screenshot.

Isn't all this safety guards and long life extension measures supposed to be handled automatically between Inverter/BMS via CAN?

On my inverter (SunSynk) the max charge/discharge rates are set to lower than what the BMS advertises and when SOC hits 98% the BMS lowers the charge rate to 10A and the inverter does comply then it carries on slower charging until 100% at which point the BMS signals max charge rate as 0A.

22 minutes ago, jgdt said:

My batteries just hit SOC 100% at the time of screenshot.

Almost hour later the cell voltages has settled down a bit after 100% SOC, as per screenshot. But the "Total_voltage overvoltage protection" error remains. Guess it will only be cleared after a while. Also what's the "Intermittent power supply waiting" warning about?

 

edit: Regarding "Intermittent power supply waiting": quoting Jumper earlier in thread: "...already reached 100% SOC and the BMS won't allow charging again until it reaches 96%. That is what the "Intermittent Power Supply Waiting" message tells you, it is basically "Battery Waiting (to be discharged)"."  before it will charge up again.

Edited March 9, 20233 yr by jgdt
Answer to " "Intermittent power supply waiting" question.

12 minutes ago, jgdt said:

Almost hour later the cell voltages has settled down a bit after 100% SOC, as per screenshot. But the "Total_voltage overvoltage protection" error remains. Guess it will only be cleared after a while. Also what's the "Intermittent power supply waiting" warning about?

At least the BMS is doing what is designed for, to protect the individual cells, at the present state the BMS is waiting for everything to stabilize before starting to float. It shut down all charging to the battery.  As you can see is on standby mode, Petty you don't have charging voltage history, I'm pre sure that the individual cell voltage it went past 3,6 V

Edited March 9, 20233 yr by Antonio de Sa