I'm looking for some wisdom from the forum to select a safe, reliable battery with a long lifespan.

I've been a lurker here for some while, pouring over the various threads, but have finally signed up because I need some help trying to negotiate the current battery market landscape in South Africa, and am hoping your collective experiences can help me.

I am looking to purchase 6x 100AH 19" rackmount LiFePO4 batteries. I am shipping to Mauritius, which is rather expensive, so I want to do it all in one go. This also means any warranty is rather useless to me, since shipping back would cost more than the value of any battery. So I need to know that what I'm buying is of high quality and that I can support it myself (eg replace cells or reprogram BMS) without having to ship back to manufacturers.

I do want:

• 16 new, reputable, trustworthy, LiFePO4 cells of at least 100Ah in the box.
• CAN comms to a Victron system (VE.Can, to Cerbo-GX), running DVCC.
• a BMS where the protocol is known, and software available to end users. I may want to reprogram to start balancing early, and generally only charge to 80 or 90% SOC, rather than 100%, to extend battery cycle life, with the occasional charge to full, to reset the SOC counters. I'm likewise over-speccing the bank's capacity so that I don't need to use much more than 50% of the pack daily. It looks like a lot of the units on the local market use a Pace BMS.
• I would prefer normal 6mm or 8mm lug connections, rather than the proprietary Amphenol connectors that some brands use.

I don't want:

• any "smart" wifi or bluetooth features with cloud linking etc.

Some findings from various threads on this forum and browsing the vendors' websites, in no particular order:

Blue Nova -- Can anyone tell me what cells are used in the BP vs DU units? DU claims 100AH useable capacity. Does this mean they're actually using higher capacity cells internally, and only exposing 100Ah?  Is the BMS re-programmable (I don't care about voiding the warranty)? It's heavy for a 16 cell 100AH pack, which is why I'm curious.

Kodak BL5.0  -- what have they rebranded here? what cells and BMS?

Rentech -- This is another rebrand? What cells and BMS are in here? What few pics I've seen look like they might use Amphenol connectors and need special cables/plugs; is this true? I just want ordinary lugs.

Sunsynk LFP -- seem to be options with CATL or BYD 104Ah cells (new?). Is ether one better than the other? 6000 cycles at 80% DOD @25C, to 60% EOL, sounds believable and I really like that they tell us what cells are in the box. But they also use annoying connectors? Are they supplied in the box? What BMS?

Freedom Won e5000 -- no rackmount ears included, but comes with cables. Pace BMS? What cells are in here? This one seems physically larger than all the others, but same weight, which seems strange. Other Freedom Wons I should be considering?
 
Revov -- not clear if their R100 or B100 systems now both have CAN ports. Various videos and pictures seem to show different things and the B100 launch video specifically states that it was designed not to integrate with the chargers. Their datasheets' pics only show RS485. But I gather they added CAN support after the initial launch. Also not sure if the B100 is new cells, or if they're also 2nd life, like the R100, in which case, what's the difference? What BMS are they shipping in these units now? Still Tian?

Dyness BL5.0C -- the old B4850 used pouch cells, which I don't like. What cells are in the DL5.0C? BMS?

Hubble AM-5 -- seems to have been many issues in the past, but resolved now? What cells are in the AM-5 model? not pouch, I hope. Still Pace BMS?

Shoto SDA10-48100 -- seems to be expensive relative to the others.

Pylontech UP5000 is only 4.8kWh? not LiFEPO4?

CFE 5.12kWh -- not heard of this one before and not much info available. Strange BMS with lots of DIP switches?

Have I missed any that I should be considering? I'd prefer to buy a boxed solution, but if I can't be sure what's in the box, then I might have to go the DIY route.

 

Hi

from personal experience I recommend that you do not even consider cfe batteries. See posts on this forum re cfe batteries.

Went for a greenrich battery after waiting 3 months without a battery.

Good luck with your search

Consider the Gobel Power batteries as well. Off Grid Garage has had some great reviews on them.
https://www.gobelpower.com/gobel-power-gpsr1pc200-standard-512v-280ah-15kwh-10kw-lifepo4-server-rack-battery_p107.html

Another good contender are the SVolt batteries which now have local support in SA too and are very well priced. They are one of the big names in the EV market too.

Thanks for the responses. I've mailed some South African SVolt resellers to ask if they'd ship to Mauritius, which would be ideal, but I'm not very hopeful. I've also emailed Gobel about their 280Ah system with EVE cells, which is appealing to me. Maybe they'll drop-ship direct?!

 

I think the BMS is less of an issue now. Most can be unlocked and even if I must replace it, they're not too expensive to buy separately. So I guess my only remaining concern is for the cells in the boxes. It seems like SA owners don't generally open their expensive boxes' lids to find out what's inside (can't blame 'em!) and the integrators either don't respond to my queries or are very shifty and won't tell me. So I might never get an answer for many of these units. That simply puts me off buying them.

On 2024/05/20 at 2:19 PM, JAmBer said:

Hubble AM-5 -- seems to have been many issues in the past, but resolved now? What cells are in the AM-5 model? not pouch, I hope. Still Pace BMS?

 

 

AM-5 are listed as "LFP Prismatic cells". I'm not aware of major issues with this model (in contrast to the older AM-2 which had some capacity-related issues resolved in firmware - part of the reason why I leaned towards the AM-5 myself early last year) but I did need to upgrade firmware on the AM-5 to improve SOC reporting when I added a second one in parallel; so the AM-5 wasn't flawless either. Hubble also imposed an 80A limit on charging [despite the 100A rating!] that was sorted with the latest firmware as well. (Hubble send an executable to do so which requires a USB to RS232 cable; or they can do it via Anydesk; but the newer battery was already up-to-date in my case so it was only the older one that needed upgrading). My older AM-5  has been worked pretty hard and has performed well in my use-case.

Edited May 22, 20242 yr by JayMardern

46 minutes ago, JayMardern said:

in contrast to the older AM-2

My own AM-2 batteries have been trouble free from the start.
The first one passed the 1000cycle mark recently. Manufacture date 06/21 and I have been using it since Aug 21. 
My second is from last year and that I added in Sep last year and I run completely  off grid now. Batteries end up in the morning between 30 an 40% mostly. 
From my perspective they have been excellent.

32 minutes ago, zsde said:

My own AM-2 batteries have been trouble free from the start.
The first one passed the 1000cycle mark recently. Manufacture date 06/21 and I have been using it since Aug 21. 
My second is from last year and that I added in Sep last year and I run completely  off grid now. Batteries end up in the morning between 30 an 40% mostly. 
From my perspective they have been excellent.

Yeah my installer mentioned he has over 120 AM-2s installed with just a single reported sudden-low-SoC issue that Hubble fixed in only 2 days - and he continues to sell/install them happily.

Threads like these might concern buyers - but in my case I went for the AM-5 because I'm a fan of LFP; otherwise I'd have picked up an AM-2 without much hesitation.

On 2024/05/21 at 9:28 AM, JAmBer said:

Gobel about their 280Ah system with EVE cells

Check out his latest video, comparing his factory assembled version and the latest DIY. 
Links are in his comments as well
 

 

Edited May 22, 20242 yr by zsde

17 hours ago, zsde said:

Check out his latest video, comparing his factory assembled version and the latest DIY. 
Links are in his comments as well

Thanks, I did watch that. Andy seems to speak highly of the Gobel solution and I'm leaning in this direction now too, despite the unwieldy 112kg boxes that I'd have to lug up a flight of stairs! The Gobel 280Ah "Premium" battery, with EVE cells, comes in around USD8.28/Ah, but I understand that they're technically B-grade cells (albeit tested) and I'm still waiting on the shipping quote.

This compares to the quotes I've been getting from SA for Rentechs, Dyness, Blue Nova, Revovs etc ranging from USD13.38 to USD 17.13 per Ah, delivered to my door, with some of the resellers claiming they have BYD or EVE "A-grade" cells inside (which I'm skeptical about).

This morning I got a quote for USD26.00/cell for a crate (QTY 105) of 105Ah cells (brand new, actual factory-fresh "A-grade" cells from EVE), which is pretty cheap. Shipping port-to-port is only 640 USD, so this works out to a very cost-effective USD7.23 per Ah, but of course I still need to box/mount them and need a BMS (about $100). And I'm not sure I want to bother with all this trouble if I can get a quality boxed solution for a similar price.

Just to add to the knowledge of the forum for anyone stumbling across this thread later...

 

Gobel's "Standard" version has Hithium cells, which is significantly cheaper than the EVE cells in the "Premium" version (USD 1857 vs 2272 for JK BMS versions). Switching from JK to Pace BMS adds another $60. Shipping costs the same (USD 350) for qty 1 or qty 3 batteries to Mauritius, but it's only "CIF", which means it doesn't include the destination-side services like customs clearance, or onward delivery to your door. I'm still trying to understand all these logistics terms, which is new to me.

 

I've not had any further clarity on the cells being bundled in the SA brands. I plan to pop the lid of whatever I end up buying and scan a few QR codes so that I at least know what I've bought. I'll try to share that here.

On 2024/05/20 at 2:19 PM, JAmBer said:

Revov -- not clear if their R100 or B100 systems now both have CAN ports. Various videos and pictures seem to show different things and the B100 launch video specifically states that it was designed not to integrate with the chargers. Their datasheets' pics only show RS485. But I gather they added CAN support after the initial launch. Also not sure if the B100 is new cells, or if they're also 2nd life, like the R100, in which case, what's the difference? What BMS are they shipping in these units now? Still Tian?

The R100 and B100 both use the Pace BMS and have CAN support. The B100 is new cells not 2nd life. The company I work for has installed quite a few of these and we've had fewer problems with the R100s. They use prismatic cells but weld the bus bars driectly onto the cells so you would not be able to replace a cell yourself. We've had issues occasionally with the R9 and C8 BMSes (now DR but they have used Tian and Pace previously) and victron communication but very few with the Pace BMS used in the R100, B100 and R200.

If you are looking at a DIY option I recently built a custom battery using cells from lithium-cells.co.za and, while not tested long term, I was very impressed with their responsiveness and support.

I also built my own +_15kw battery using a company called Apexium, they are a Chinese company with a warehouse in JHB. I bought the 16 280ah cells and the BMS and built my own box. Another brand to look out for is BSL.