Jump to content

Axpert King 5kW


Recommended Posts

Hey guys

Basically there is no info available on the Axpert King 5kW inverter, except from Voltronic. I bought one recently (got it for R10k + R150 shipping). Thought I would post some pics & info as I gather.

Top view:

fully_assembled.thumb.jpg.71ebd5a44fcd09d6f23f5605f3488d23.jpg

Top view with the control panel cover removed:

top_plate_removed.thumb.jpg.be4d496a5aeeda2026c69222bd01d940.jpg

Wiring cover removed:

wiring_cover_removed.thumb.png.d26341a1ad76f7d5cd901fff1368f1d2.png

Rear of the device:

Rear.thumb.jpg.3b89715ae81149cd8698ed45160e92aa.jpg

Some specs not available in the manual:

  • DC Input (hole size): 24.90mm x 30.45mm (plastic removed)
  • PV Input, AC Input, AC Ouput (hole size): 30.45 x 24.95 (plastic removed)
  • Controller wire & plugs: Wire is 8 wire, 24 awg, rated 300v (rating on cable) with RJ45 plugs. Pretty much standard network cable (24 awg mind you)
  • Chassis external ground stud is electrically connected to AC Input Ground
  • AC Input Neutral is NOT electrically connected to AC Input Ground
  • AC Input Ground is electrically connected to AC Output Neutral
  • AC Input Neutral & Live are not in continuity with either AC Output Neutral & Live
  • Controller RJ45 output has no pins connected to ground (nor is the metal part on the connector connected to ground). So shielded cable may not behave as you expected

Measurements made using:

Some thoughts on the internals:

  • Most of the money clearly went into the MPPT. The MPPT features Jamicon capacitors and the MPPT input on the inverter also features those.
  • Input surge suppression is actually really good and it is mounted on its own board making it really easy to swap out any burnt MOVs.
  • Conformal coating over some components. Every single opto-coupler had significant amounts of conformal coating over it.
  • The inverter itself has Jianghai branded capacitors
  • The device is clearly made on a budget, for example smaller capacitors not sitting flush in many places (even smaller inductors here and there)
  • Input, Output & Ground all feature a huge ferrite chokes for noise suppression
  • The ferrite chokes that are just sort of hanging around and not stuck down in any way (not impressed by that)
  • Fans were blowing downward and outward which is just stupid. You want fans blowing in to create turbulent air which cools better. More importantly you want fans blowing upward because hot air rises

Updates to follow:

  • Pics of internals
  • Oscilloscope output, including output on Bypass (Utility), Utility (Bypass disabled), Battery and switch over
  • Confirm if existing Axpert commands work using Serial and USB
  • Control panel overview and running control panel remotely by extending it using ethernet cable
  • Bluetooth functionality test (I suspect it will just be the same protocol as Serial/USB but over BT, time will tell)
Edited by Gnome
Link to post
Share on other sites

In case you are wondering why I bought this:

  • I need a UPS, I have sensitive equipment
  • I don't have PV and don't need PV
  • This device has claimed 0ms transfer time (maybe double conversion, to be confirmed)

The company I bought this from originally put the device up as R8.5k and I immediately ordered one. Then they called to say they made a mistake (which I immediately knew was going to be the case while ordering). I cut them a break and they quoted me R10k which is still less than their normal price.

So overall for a high quality UPS that isn't very expensive (if you know your UPS)

EDIT: I'll need to take pictures again, these are terrible quality :p

Edited by Gnome
Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, Gnome said:

AC Input Ground is electrically connected to AC Output Neutral

That's the same with the Axperts that come with main firmware version 73.00. However, this is via a normally-closed relay contact, and as soon as the inverter is in bypass mode, the relay changes position and the neutral to earth is not connected.

So it may not be a solid always-on connection.

When you get to power it up, can you tell us the firmware version(s)? I'm curious as to how similar or different these are to the usual Axperts. If they are indeed dual conversion, then they'd need different firmware.

Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, Coulomb said:

So it may not be a solid always-on connection.

If it is double-conversion, I suspect it will be always on. Can't think of a reason to open it. Normally you open it to prevent issues with an upstream RCD, but unless I'm thinking about this all wrong that can't happen if it is permanently isolated via a transformer.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I opened up the inverter, I'll add some hi-res pics shortly.

Pics after I slimmed down the inverter. The fans also blew downward and outward. Bad design decision. Fans should blow inward to create turbulent air over components which improves cooling.

Anyway I turned the fans around to blow upward and inward.

No more MPPT:

internals_slimmed.thumb.jpg.7d39433297dae5cd9b036ce553395d10.jpg

No more parallel & PV connection:

outside_slim.thumb.jpg.2b47f93b53670ac9187b23151bdf2064.jpg

Edited by Gnome
Link to post
Share on other sites
10 minutes ago, Gnome said:

Extra components I had over after re-assembly

I like!

In your case that was by design, my case it is not so.

Somehow parts are always left over afterwards that don't seem to have a place to fit, nor do they seem needed. :D

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Chris Hobson said:

That only happens with an over-engineered Victron (which has two of everything) :P.

Why would I ever want to open one ... it works. :P

Do you know the troubles I am going through to change a perfectly working, if old, system, having only once briefly taken off the front cover, and I replaced it with all the screws back in their right places? 

I like what Gnome is doing. He is fixing his Axpert, making it into a solid reliable UPS, none of this MPPT nonsense and no setting worries.

Link to post
Share on other sites
31 minutes ago, The Terrible Triplett said:

He is fixing his Axpert, making it into a solid reliable UPS, none of this MPPT nonsense and no setting worries.

To be fair tho, the MPPT is the one part of this system that has the highest quality components and construction quality.

I suspect it is the part that gives Voltronic the most problems so they decided no to cheap out on it.

Kind of sad that I paid for it and I'm basically just removing it :p

Link to post
Share on other sites

The only clues to double conversion I can see so far are

* The new square PCB in one corner near the MPPT board. I think that this may have the PFC inductor on it. It has two black wires going off to it, both 10 AWG (5 mm²).

* The mains heat-sink might be a little longer, and there are two new grey capacitors near where the black wires connect to the main board, which I've not seen before.

* There is a new choke, with brown flexible wire, which I assume must be for EMI, not power conversion.

These new parts may make up a 5 kW Power Factor Corrected (PFC) power supply, converting mains to ~450 VDC to power the inverter continuously. The inverter stage doesn't seem to have changed much at all.

Thanks for the pictures, @Gnome.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Jeez spent a bunch of time getting this installed. GF isn't here so I had to hoist the inverter up using rope. 1/10 would not recommend

Anyway, install pic with it running in bypass:

installed.thumb.jpg.5cacc79f2ee36ec77bd0036a55802944.jpg

I'll leave it running in bypass over night (IE> utility is feeding to output), simply because I want to be awake during first runtime, just in case.

For those interested, the wiring running to AC is 6mm T&E and the DC wiring is 70mm. I'm using a 350 amp disconnector

This isn't the final resting place of the disconnector, nor the display. I need to do more work later, but for today I'm done.

Edited by Gnome
Link to post
Share on other sites
52 minutes ago, Coulomb said:

* The new square PCB in one corner near the MPPT board. I think that this may have the PFC inductor on it. It has two black wires going off to it, both 10 AWG (5 mm²).

I thought so also (PFC). And yes it is probably the biggest inductor of everything inside.

52 minutes ago, Coulomb said:

 * The mains heat-sink might be a little longer, and there are two new grey capacitors near where the black wires connect to the main board, which I've not seen before.

The two big caps at the top (close to PFC) is 500v 470µF rated Jianghai caps.

The caps directly beneath the MPPT were Jamicon and the caps closest to the fans/next to the transformer are Jianghai.

As far as Chinese caps go Jianghai seems to be one of the few "trusted" brands. (after some googling). Would still have been nice to have Jamicon for everything

MPPT controller has exclusively Jamicon caps.

52 minutes ago, Coulomb said:

* There is a new choke, with brown flexible wire, which I assume must be for EMI, not power conversion.

Yep, like I said in the updated first post. Neutral, Earth and Live each has a choke. As you say, almost certainly for EMI suppression.

52 minutes ago, Coulomb said:

These new parts may make up a 5 kW Power Factor Corrected (PFC) power supply, converting mains to ~450 VDC to power the inverter continuously. The inverter stage doesn't seem to have changed much at all.

Well if it works, why change it :p

52 minutes ago, Coulomb said:

Thanks for the pictures, @Gnome.

No problem, it will be good for me if I need to put everything back. Also good for me to verify facts for future incursions.

Edited by Gnome
Link to post
Share on other sites

Sigh, I set my battery voltage too high last night and completely killed one of my batteries. They are cheapo "Excis" 100Ah batteries (Bought in 2015). I set the Axpert to Flooded battery in the configuration menu but I think this is what did it in. During the bulk stage it hit 14.6v per cell and I guess that was too high for one of the batteries. Or it is too old, who knows. Either way the battery starting making spluttering/cracking noises (probably outgassing). It has a dead cell now. Put any load on it and the voltage quickly drops to 9v.

At first I thought the Axpert died on me because lights started faintly flickering. I turned off AC to see what happens and it immediately turns off with an error: Battery not connected

Still I thought it was probably the Axpert (Being new and all). Did some more testing (I attached a multimeter to each battery and the +- terminals on the Axpert). Voltage on the bank was fluctuating between 46->40v rapidly. According to my clamp meter (Uni-T UT210E) there was approx. 1/2 amp passing through the DC bus. So any load on the battery = sadness. Definitely bad cell.

Still I'll take it to a battery place to confirm my findings.

This confirms the Axpert King is double conversion because it caused the voltage to fluctuate slightly (in line mode) between 220v -> 240v. I'm considering running it like this with the o-scope on just to see how well it can keep the waveform under these terrible conditions.

Very sad that I need to get new batteries now.

Got very sad at one point thinking I may have ruined my inverter or it is a piece of garbage (I was voting for the latter because I was really careful while working on it).

This confirms to me that there is something to be said for APC UPS' that do a battery test by switching to battery mode every so often.

Edited by Gnome
Link to post
Share on other sites
44 minutes ago, Gnome said:

"Excis" 100Ah batteries (Bought in 2015)

That one batt has a short internally, may have been coming for a while. Note: That battery can explode if it gets too hot.

Still it is sad to now have to replace a whole bank prematurely.

Just a thing I learnt yesterday. I have 4 Trojans, as couple of years old, down to SOC of 60% a few times, seldom below 80%.

Because they are not used like in a golf cart / forklift, supplier said, go ahead, add 4 more for 48v bank. You may go from 10 years life to 9 years and 10 months.

Just a thought.

Link to post
Share on other sites
23 minutes ago, The Terrible Triplett said:

Still it is sad to now have to replace a whole bank prematurely.

Well I bought it in 2015, so not too premature :p I suspect for those batteries that is quite a lifetime. Got them for 1.5k ea back then I just jumped on it.

22 minutes ago, The Terrible Triplett said:

That one batt has a short internally, may have been coming for a while. Note: That battery can explode if it gets too hot.

Noted thanks for the warning!

23 minutes ago, The Terrible Triplett said:

Just a thing I learnt yesterday. I have 4 Trojans, as couple of years old, down to SOC of 60% a few times, seldom below 80%.

Not fully sure what I'll get to replace these budget batteries.

 

Edited by Gnome
Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, Gnome said:

... bought it in 2015, so not too premature ...

No, not too premature no. And at that price in 2005, you paid the right price for them. :-) I know, that's what I sold them for with a little bit of profit.

On standby you should get 5 years from them, in a UPS, with not too many Eskom failures.

But, there where duds in between the masses of them sold.

Still sad to have to replace a bank of batteries. :-) 

At LEAST now you can go bigger than any APC can handle.

If ever I am really desperate, having a 24v 1kva APC online UPS standing here, I swear I will hook it up to a 24v Trojan bank with a Victron controller to charge the bank.
With a BMV to not drain it too low.

Link to post
Share on other sites
10 minutes ago, Gnome said:

Not fully sure what I'll get to replace these budget batteries.

Trojans J200RE's - 12v 200ah If you can handle the hydrogen.

Drop me a PM, can sort you out nicely. Energy won't shoot me ... yet. :-) 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...