Hi, City Powers new prepaid tariff now includes a monthly service and capacity charge. I assume this only applies to grid tide prepaid uses. I have a prepaid meter but don’t use it as we are off grid so assume we won’t have to pay the capacity and service monthly fee. Does anyone know?

2 hours ago, Jaybabe said:

Hi, City Powers new prepaid tariff now includes a monthly service and capacity charge. I assume this only applies to grid tide prepaid uses. I have a prepaid meter but don’t use it as we are off grid so assume we won’t have to pay the capacity and service monthly fee. Does anyone know?

Not paying the fee means they can come and remove the meter. 

Interesting question

The concern is that the R230 peronth keeps adding up if you don't pay. What if in 10 years they force us to settle this?

I normally only use R100 per month, but now to pay the R230 I need to load over R500 per month for them to subtract the fee (they only take half the fee if the recharge is below this).

What do I do with the unused kWh I pay for and never use?

The only solution is if the outstanding fees do not roll over to the next month, but info on whether this is the case are contradictory.

Does anyone know?

On 2024/07/01 at 5:39 PM, Jaybabe said:

Hi, City Powers new prepaid tariff now includes a monthly service and capacity charge. I assume this only applies to grid tide prepaid uses. I have a prepaid meter but don’t use it as we are off grid so assume we won’t have to pay the capacity and service monthly fee. Does anyone know?

The fixed fees are for having a meter, you pay per unit for the useage. They apply to any non-idigent household that has a pre-paid meter, whether or not you have solar.

Remember that the new tariffs kicked in July 1st, so the unit cost of electricity has gone up, so even if there were no flat fees you'd be paying more than R100.

AIUI the minimum purchase now is R400 a month.

R200 will settle the fixed fees.
The rest goes to units and VAT for fees and units. The VAT on the fixed fees will be R30.

I am going to buy as soon as I get my statement, so I will be able to confirm then.

Also AIUI the fixedfees can't be rolled over for more than one month. But if you try to buy every 2nd month you will be spending R800 every second month. So no saving.

23 hours ago, Dman said:

What do I do with the unused kWh I pay for and never use?

They will accumulate your on your meter. City Power say you shouldn't bank a lot of units on your meter. This is why if they have to replace your meter there is a cap on the credit they will carry from the old meter to the new.

In my experience they don't take a credit away or even moan about it (I had 1000s of units accumulated on my old meter), but if they have to change your meter they will have no mercy.

If my calculations are correct, a purchase of R400 a month will settle the new fixed charges and leave you with 60 odd units. If you don't use the 60, the balance remains on your meter (but you will still have to buy for R400 next month). The upside of this is that if we if have a spell of overcast weather (and one always comes along) then you have credit on your meter that you can use.

23 minutes ago, Bobster. said:

They will accumulate your on your meter. City Power say you shouldn't bank a lot of units on your meter. This is why if they have to replace your meter there is a cap on the credit they will carry from the old meter to the new.

In my experience they don't take a credit away or even moan about it (I had 1000s of units accumulated on my old meter), but if they have to change your meter they will have no mercy.

If my calculations are correct, a purchase of R400 a month will settle the new fixed charges and leave you with 60 odd units. If you don't use the 60, the balance remains on your meter (but you will still have to buy for R400 next month). The upside of this is that if we if have a spell of overcast weather (and one always comes along) then you have credit on your meter that you can use.

Thanks Bobster. Yes, that makes sense, but I rarely use anything over 30 units per month, so each year I'll have 300 units spare which I'll never use. 

The ideal (as I am happy-ish to pay the fixed fee) is a way I can just pay the R200 a month fee seperately.

The alternative is I load R200 each month. Then they will apparently only deduct R100 for the fixed fee and give me R100 in units. This is because for small recharge amounts they only put half toward the fixed fee. May be an option?

2 minutes ago, Dman said:

Thanks Bobster. Yes, that makes sense, but I rarely use anything over 30 units per month, so each year I'll have 300 units spare which I'll never use. 

The ideal (as I am happy-ish to pay the fixed fee) is a way I can just pay the R200 a month fee seperately.

The alternative is I load R200 each month. Then they will apparently only deduct R100 for the fixed fee and give me R100 in units. This is because for small recharge amounts they only put half toward the fixed fee. May be an option?

It's R200 + VAT per month. I too was hoping that this would be a line item on the statement, then I could pay that and manage my meter as I always have. The problem is that they didn't communicate that the fixed fees would be recovered from your purchases.

In the example you give, they would take R100 + VAT towards the fixed fees, and give you units + VAT for the R85 that remains. But you will be R115 in arrears, and your arrears will grow each month.

14 minutes ago, Bobster. said:

 But you will be R115 in arrears, and your arrears will grow each month.

Also becoming a bank. Charging a higher interest rate than they pay on their debt? on your outstanding amount. 

On 2024/07/04 at 4:09 PM, Bobster. said:

It's R200 + VAT per month. I too was hoping that this would be a line item on the statement, then I could pay that and manage my meter as I always have. The problem is that they didn't communicate that the fixed fees would be recovered from your purchases.

In the example you give, they would take R100 + VAT towards the fixed fees, and give you units + VAT for the R85 that remains. But you will be R115 in arrears, and your arrears will grow each month.

That's true. My idea is to keep paying on month late. So in August I pay R230 first, so the full fee for July is paid (if the system does this), and then top up with another R200, which will give me R85 in units, then repeat the next month. 

I'll test it and post the results

I suppose if you only want to pay the fixed fee you would need to pay for each month in arrears i.e. R230 in August for July, R230 in September for August etc. 

Is there a way to determine your outstanding service fee?

I don't think there is a way, and I am guessing the outstanding fee does not roll-over, so if you don't pay it this month they won't charge you double the next month. If they were to acccumulate there would be issues when selling the house and the new owenr would need to take over the debt, but woiuld not know about it. I have been skipping months and they still allow recharges.

On 2024/07/10 at 5:57 PM, slipx said:

I suppose if you only want to pay the fixed fee you would need to pay for each month in arrears i.e. R230 in August for July, R230 in September for August etc. 

No. Because of the way they apportion it. For small purchases half goes to the service charge and half for electricity and VAT (otherwise people who buy a little each week will have problems). So the minimum you should buy a month is R400. This settles the service charge and gives you 62.5 units.

 

41 minutes ago, PurePower said:

Is there a way to determine your outstanding service fee?

I don't know if they show it on the statement. But neighbours have reported that if they skip a month, they get for R400 + VAT the next month. So if M = months since last purchase or since July 1 (whichever is later) then you calculate it as 
M * 200 * 1.15

Edited December 13, 20241 yr by Bobster.
clarity

37 minutes ago, Dman said:

I don't think there is a way, and I am guessing the outstanding fee does not roll-over, so if you don't pay it this month they won't charge you double the next month. If they were to acccumulate there would be issues when selling the house and the new owenr would need to take over the debt, but woiuld not know about it. I have been skipping months and they still allow recharges.

That is exactly what they do. The service charge is per month, not per purchase. If you don't buy this month you will get hit for R400 next month.

5 hours ago, Bobster. said:

That is exactly what they do. The service charge is per month, not per purchase. If you don't buy this month you will get hit for R400 next month.

I did not purchase anything in November. I bought in December and there was no carrying over of any outstanding service fee.

11 minutes ago, slipx said:

I did not purchase anything in November. I bought in December and there was no carrying over of any outstanding service fee.

OK, you're a braver man than me. Reports in my neighbourhood at that they are getting hit if they skip a month.

But look at the arithmetic I outlined earlier. If your first purchase in the month is R50 and you have no outstanding balance, then R25 goes to the service fee, but you still owe R175.

The complaints I am hearing are not from solar owners. They are just trying to beat the system by buying two month's worth of credit every second month. But they are reporting that R400 gets deducted on the 2nd purchase (2 months after the previous).

So it depends on how much you bought. Solar owners don't buy much. So is it possible that you bought for R400 and the usual formula was applied and R200 was deducted for the service charge but you still have R200 outstanding? I don't know how one checks, but it'd be helpful. I'm a bangbroek. I just buy R400 early each month. It's about neutral because I average about 2 units a day. So the 62.5 is just enough, but one day I may need to top up a bit more.

The regulations are clear: The charge is per month, not per purchase. But I don't think this has been properly thought through - there seems to be no way of knowing if you are in arrears or not.



 

On 2024/12/13 at 4:12 PM, Bobster. said:

OK, you're a braver man than me. Reports in my neighbourhood at that they are getting hit if they skip a month.

But look at the arithmetic I outlined earlier. If your first purchase in the month is R50 and you have no outstanding balance, then R25 goes to the service fee, but you still owe R175.

The complaints I am hearing are not from solar owners. They are just trying to beat the system by buying two month's worth of credit every second month. But they are reporting that R400 gets deducted on the 2nd purchase (2 months after the previous).

So it depends on how much you bought. Solar owners don't buy much. So is it possible that you bought for R400 and the usual formula was applied and R200 was deducted for the service charge but you still have R200 outstanding? I don't know how one checks, but it'd be helpful. I'm a bangbroek. I just buy R400 early each month. It's about neutral because I average about 2 units a day. So the 62.5 is just enough, but one day I may need to top up a bit more.

The regulations are clear: The charge is per month, not per purchase. But I don't think this has been properly thought through - there seems to be no way of knowing if you are in arrears or not.



 

Yes Bobster, it works as you are saying - there is a month-to-month carry-over and the amount will build up. I did not buy for a few months and in Jan bought R1,000 and R500 was deducted as the fee for the outstanding months. So at minimum every month we will need to buy for R480 in order that the fee for the month is paid or it will accumulate. Unfortunately I don't need the extra R240 of units per month but still need to buy these to pay the fee. They should have a way of paying JUST the monthly fee

31 minutes ago, Dman said:

Yes Bobster, it works as you are saying - there is a month-to-month carry-over and the amount will build up. I did not buy for a few months and in Jan bought R1,000 and R500 was deducted as the fee for the outstanding months. So at minimum every month we will need to buy for R480 in order that the fee for the month is paid or it will accumulate. Unfortunately I don't need the extra R240 of units per month but still need to buy these to pay the fee. They should have a way of paying JUST the monthly fee

It's currently 400. You buy for R400 and that settles the monthly fees of R200 (incl VAT) and gives you 62.5 units. I buy that every month, and the amount the city deducts for service never creeps upward.

2 hours ago, Bobster. said:

It's currently 400. You buy for R400 and that settles the monthly fees of R200 (incl VAT) and gives you 62.5 units. I buy that every month, and the amount the city deducts for service never creeps upward.

I do exactly the same. It would be really nice to have a way to query what your outstanding fees are and also just settle that amount every month. I dont need the 62.5 units per month, its accumulating now as I'm over 300 units and growing... lol 

Edited February 2, 20251 yr by PurePower

I think it is R460 you need to pay to cover the monthly fee once you add the VAT. You might not see it creep up but it's accumulating the extra R30 in vat per month in the system

Where I live there are guys who misread the new tariffs as having a flat fee PER PURCHASE. That's wrong, it's PER MONTH. So they bought one month, sat a couple out, then bought again and found they got hit with more than R200. But it was multiples of R200.

As I said, I pay R400 every month. If I was falling short, the City would start clawing back the outstanding balance when I purchase, as happened to my neighbours. But every month it's the same. R200 for the admin fees, and 62.5 units. If I was a little short, they would start deducting more for fixed fees, but they don't.

No, my experience is that no matter what you pay, the MAX they subtract is 50% of the purchase, even if you owe back-dated amounts. If you pay more you will see they keep taking 50% of ythe purchase until the backlog of fees has been deducted

1 hour ago, Dman said:

No, my experience is that no matter what you pay, the MAX they subtract is 50% of the purchase, even if you owe back-dated amounts. If you pay more you will see they keep taking 50% of ythe purchase until the backlog of fees has been deducted

OK... I'll keep an eye on it. They need a better way of letting you know how much you owe. In fact they need a way.

Since the R230 service fee was introduced I have only bought R400 prepaid every month.

To check that I don't owe them anything I bought for R600 in January.

Still they only took R200 service fee and gave me 136.10 units.

I missed a few months and then bought R100. They deducted R50 as a fee and I received the R50 in units.