Zimnismoboy34

A very very interesting specimen of cells here & actually I'd be interested in taking the entire lot. Let me do some more research. I've never worked with this chemistry...I'm very confident with LFP & I have a BMS that can be paired to this, however, there will be a lot of parallel connections. Will get gened up then make contact again, hopefully they will still be available...

The Guys over at Custom Lithium are building replacement packs for these Nissan leafs 40Kwh with 300kms +, given the average cycle life of NMC cells that would yield a life span of 600 000kms to 80% (2000 cycles with each cycle giving 300kms ) Lets work on worst case that would mean less than half the life span for our climate and or our current conditions ( say the battery only gave 1000 cycles ) thats still 300 000kms to 80% remaining capacity . Not bad i think .

Intel NUC i5 10th gen
Specifications
Intel i5 10th gen
16gb ddr4 memory
512gb  SSD
Windows 11
R4k
 
Intel NUC i7 10th gen
Specifications
Intel i7 10th gen
16gb ddr4 memory
512gb nvme SSD
Windows 11
R5k

Sold to lmj9175

running 500.08
01 ISP for MHP5000 GRT F2809_GW500.08_20200707_B-20200820T084540Z-001.zip 02 ISP for BMS F030_SK022_07_ 20200714-20200820T084559Z-001.zip

After Numerous installs and lots of hair pulling ... yes im nearly bald.
This is what i've found and believe me its not what it says on the box .!!!!
CT coil installed on the grid side . When grid is on and excess solar available Meaning batteries are charged it supplies these devices and appliances by pushing power back to the CT --- AND DRAINS THE BATTERY.
The ideal situation is that batteries are charged and excess solar is available supply the CT Side of the grid and DONT DRAIN BATTERIES.
But sadly it does and uses battery power till its empty to keep these appliances alive if the grid is on and working .. in short whats the point other then selling excess power to the grid .

So moved on and decided to redesign again .
This time did an install using the Two outputs .
Load and GEn input ( known as Aux on the Sunsynk)
I was told by the engineers that it would work like this .
Critical loads on load would always be powered by the unit and when batteries are low using the system work mode table preset SOC% it will then go to the grid / and or charge if grid charge is ticked . THIS WORKS AS INTENDED ON ALL SETTINGS SCENARIO
Aux/gen input enabled with on at 95% off at 90% and power set to 1000w . Ticking always on grid . Smart load enabled highlighted 
Connected pool pump and geyser to this output and find that it does not work as it should .
If the System work mode (deye ) is ticked and the GEN input is enabled for smart load we end up getting a situation where the Smart load comes off solar but also uses battery below the 90% setting !!! Wrong ..
After speaking to the engineers and technicians numerous attempts ive still not gotten a firm answer from them .Seems the feature is part of the advertising but doesnt work .
The only way to get it work is to have a contactor relay connected and disable always on grid so that the unit powers up the smart load output when its ready example conditions are met . Soc is above and solar in excess ..  And the contactor enables pulls the unit off grid onto inverter and runs till it reaches the turn off point and contactor disables ?
In which case why then are we trying to use a feature that doesnt work !
IF any one can help assist and shed some light it would really help .
 

Pylontech were the first to change the industry standard and call End of life at 60%.
I see freedomwon doing the same now too ..... in short amazing .
IEC rated has and is till to my knowledge 80% retaining capacity not 60% . 
Its easy to say my battery will last 10 000 cycles to 20% EOL ? REALLY!
Come on guys some logic here .
Yes the pylontech are rated to 6500 cycles at 60% which if maths does me justice proves a cycle life of 4000 cycles roughly at 80% and if we change the low voltage cut off and high voltage cut off to 2.5v and 3.65v (lifepo4) then we get less to about 2500 to 3500 cycles does the vision start becoming a little clearer ?
All good quality batteries come with a cycle life estimated .
But all batteries @25 deg C usage for their whole lives at low C discharge and charge rates will last a super long time .
Temp kills batteries have said it time and time again .
Low c rates = low internal temps .
used indoors 25deg C = long cycle life 
Narrow voltage SOC window = Long cycle life 
There is more to this equation i can go into more detail .
But can i ask does hubble both 100x and AM series only have rs485 ?

some one asked about the pylontech warranty void scenario .
Yes its real .
Yes you must not clip the max current limit 
Doing so voids your warranty !!!
An extract from the phocos any grid installation manual to back up what the user went through !

 

And another !!!

in short if you dont use like 6 us2000 or 5 us3000 batteries you are going to risk overloading the batteries ! 
All it takes is one current peak over discharge and your warranty is = NULL.

some one asked about the pylontech warranty void scenario .
Yes its real .
Yes you must not clip the max current limit 
Doing so voids your warranty !!!
An extract from the phocos any grid installation manual to back up what the user went through !

 

running 500.08
01 ISP for MHP5000 GRT F2809_GW500.08_20200707_B-20200820T084540Z-001.zip 02 ISP for BMS F030_SK022_07_ 20200714-20200820T084559Z-001.zip

By "charging symbol" do you mean the dotted lines pointing into the battery?
Or the "CC" in the bottom right corner?
Browsing the 500.07 firmware today, I see that the variable I'm calling chargeStage can only have three values, 1, 2, or 3, and in various commands these display as FC, CC, and CV respectively. I assume that these mean Float Charge, Constant Current, and Constant Voltage. So it's surprising to see the firmware apparently not charging at all. I suppose it's possible that this variable has been set to an invalid value somehow; if so, that's definitely a firmware bug.
Of course, there may be other variables that determine charge stage, I don't pretend to understand even 1% of the Growatt firmware as yet.

and inverter still takes its power from the battery when in standby ? pulling my hair out .

so fair is fair ...
I say this because ive done some more testing research and digging .
I have been provided the latest 500.80 firmware that does stages of indicative charge CC CV and FC
Constant current, Constant voltage and float charge if the term has any lack of definition as many say lithium cannot be floated but does have a open Terminal voltage to be maintained..
So using rs485 we charge up to 100% and then solar pv switches off and waits till we reach 94.9% then turns on again ... all the mean while long battery and inverter is carrying the loads .. TOTALLY WRONG .
shouldnt be doing this .
Its purely a firmware issue only way around it is go back to standard USE setting and use the predefined target Bulk voltage and float as a (MARKER) let the voltage drop and the inverter solar knows it should power the loads .

a secret.. the 5000ES can run with no battery connected .. is a high voltage mppt (450VDC) input .
And better yet .. works well on the lithium setting and leaves solar on with the correct settings .. to be confirmed with pylontech .. maybe a user can chime in but it should work with out floating the batteries to high and keeping solar on ready and waiting when loads are being powered .. So far seems to work well on my end solar not turning on and off and batteries are kept charged with minimal current passing either way .

i am in talks with them big time . but sadly the language barrier is bad and getting them to understand what is required vs what they feel the system should be doing is two different things ..
still i keep on with it lets see where it takes us .

so fair is fair ...
I say this because ive done some more testing research and digging .
I have been provided the latest 500.80 firmware that does stages of indicative charge CC CV and FC
Constant current, Constant voltage and float charge if the term has any lack of definition as many say lithium cannot be floated but does have a open Terminal voltage to be maintained..
So using rs485 we charge up to 100% and then solar pv switches off and waits till we reach 94.9% then turns on again ... all the mean while long battery and inverter is carrying the loads .. TOTALLY WRONG .
shouldnt be doing this .
Its purely a firmware issue only way around it is go back to standard USE setting and use the predefined target Bulk voltage and float as a (MARKER) let the voltage drop and the inverter solar knows it should power the loads .

a secret.. the 5000ES can run with no battery connected .. is a high voltage mppt (450VDC) input .
And better yet .. works well on the lithium setting and leaves solar on with the correct settings .. to be confirmed with pylontech .. maybe a user can chime in but it should work with out floating the batteries to high and keeping solar on ready and waiting when loads are being powered .. So far seems to work well on my end solar not turning on and off and batteries are kept charged with minimal current passing either way .

to be honest i feel its not correct .. 
it should not actually do this.. some technicalities .
Target voltage on the inverter is not what is achieved -- battery defines what it needs and inverter should follow but there is a voltage drop on the cable .

battery should stay retained in voltage for internal loads etc ... inverter does not do this correctly .

battery max soc cannot be set meaning it cant charge to 80% or 90% and stop ..it aims to reach 100% not good ..no flexibility 

micro cycling .. should it happen.. no if you have enough pv you solar should drive the loads while the battery is waiting on standby ..

The big questions are 
do you have more then 4 pylontech batteries as the inverters seem to be limited to 30amp charge i stand to be corrected ... in which case you back to using the manual setting ..
I have changed over to using a 5000es with canbus and find it wiling to charge at max rate correctly .. but not on a pylontech battery on my own with our in house bms .

So there are draw backs but if you are using two batteries this would be okay . as a charge rate of 15 amps per battery is normal .. but a max charge rate of 30amp when using rs485 is not .. and seems alot of users face the same issue .

hopefully in a few months to come i can and will change the pricing game for Li-ion and energy storage in SA and africa, the orion bms is one of the best out there with feature sets that wont be used by the vast majority, its got can bus and supports RS232 connection using the orion jnr software, canbus uses a two wire network which has message sets with ids works well for environments where signal noise is really high as it is robust message system, most inverters like Victron use the canbus to plug into the expensive Color GX or inexpensive Venus and allow for battery monitoring on the victron software, as well as settable threshholds . for Float bulk and end of discharge etc . Please be aware that battery life span on Lifepo4 is dependent purely on configuration parameters and setting the battery up the right way can vary from what the manufacturer says and what is ideal on a battery system for life span.... take into account what a HP laptop battery charge and end of charge voltages are, the factory setup maximises the run time of the battery not the life span and a few years down the road you are replacing a lithium battery on your dear laptop purely because its hard on the battery ....setup the right way and get the life span you want !

Good evening Gents, i see some good chatter here and decided to chime in, seems that the local price of laptop battery cells is fairly cheap and building is the only issue with these power walls, i have vast experience and knowledge on the topic and willing to lend a hand if any one wants give me a shout send me a pm, im based in JHB and can give advice on rating, testing, sorting and choosing the correct cells if necessary, i do also have cells in stock but not at the prices you mention, to add some controversy i see that most stores around sell new 18650s for 75rand to 120 rand .....To mention a few fire hazard stories, if the pack is built with cell level fuses does it still pose a fire risk ? most cells will only ever become a fire hazard when over charged and when discharged into the ground and then 1 cell bank goes into reversal a very weird but common problem with Li ion cells in a string of series .... once the cell is in reversal if you have no way of preventing charge from entering the pack you will have a exploding fireworks show... follow the guidelines seek advice and if ever in doubt about some ones advice do the research it wont take long . I do believe Pylon tech warranty sheet needs a few re reads, they presumably warrant their packs to a end of life at 70% of original capacity ????? this doesnt sound right and most will warranty to 80% of original or 20% reduction ... secondly they will only warrant the portion of remaining 7 year life span ... use the battery for 6 years and you will end up paying for another 6 years through a complex calculation at then in the future prices which eeerrrmmm would mean buying a new battery pack from them effectively a they will only cover 2% of the cost of the battery ? interesting read ......