18 minutes ago, I84RiS said:

How far is the CT coil from the inverter. The CT coil will likely be in or close to the DB board.  It should be connected with a SINGLE TWISTED PAIR cable.

As per the opening post (3) the CT coil is quite far from the inverter…around 25m so more than the 10m limit in the specification. 

I’m not sure if the installer installed it correctly at that distance and wouldn’t know what to look for, but is it possible that that is the culprit?

10 hours ago, BlakeSA said:

Some interesting developments. I thought I had to wait for load shedding or a low SOC to test something, but that wasn't required afterall.

I have these use timer settings:

I may be way off base here, I don't have a sunsynk, but I seem to recall someone suggesting in another thread that the timer settings shouldn't go over 00:00. Maybe try changing the slots to 21:00-00:00 and 00:00-05:00.

10 hours ago, BlakeSA said:

As per the opening post (3) the CT coil is quite far from the inverter…around 25m so more than the 10m limit in the specification. 

I’m not sure if the installer installed it correctly at that distance and wouldn’t know what to look for, but is it possible that that is the culprit?

If the CT coil is not providing the correct signals it might be contributing to the symptoms.

It is used by the Inverter to measure the current flow to ensure that no power is exported when this option is selected on the inverter settings. Without it you won't be able to supply excess solar to the non essential items.

Edited December 18, 20223 yr by I84RiS

50 minutes ago, jumper said:

I may be way off base here, I don't have a sunsynk, but I seem to recall someone suggesting in another thread that the timer settings shouldn't go over 00:00. Maybe try changing the slots to 21:00-00:00 and 00:00-05:00.

I'll give that a shot thanks. I doubt it will fix the issue, but it is probably still a good idea to do it anyway.

29 minutes ago, I84RiS said:

If the CT coil is not providing the correct signals it might be contributing to the symptoms.

It is used by the Inverter to measure the current flow to ensure that no power is exported when this option is selected on the inverter settings. Without it you won't be able to supply excess solar to the non essential items.

Ja, that was what one of my friends also suggested as the possible cause. I've just struggled to create the conditions needed to test this hypothesis.

From my (limited) understanding of the setup, a inaccurate CT signal would explain why ticking the "Limit to Load Only" option seems to resolve the issue; since that no longer pushes power from the Inverter into the non-essential circuit and doesn't hit the grid at all.

And it would (possibly?) explain why the issues happen on time zone changeovers in the morning or at night (pulling from battery+solar and then suddenly switching to full grid or via versa) or after load shedding. Maybe due to the distance there is a delay in the CT coil signal and the inverter is pushing a tad more than what the CT coil is asking for and causing it to trigger a grid disconnect.

Any suggestion on how to test this and force the hiccup behaviour without damaging any of the equipment? If the issue is related to the CT-Inverter distance, it will require some investment to fix it, and I'd like to be sure before I spend more money.

Have you already lowered the grid reconnection time from 60s down to around 10s or maybe even less, and did it make any difference?

1 hour ago, BlakeSA said:

Any suggestion on how to test this and force the hiccup behaviour without damaging any of the equipment? If the issue is related to the CT-Inverter distance, it will require some investment to fix it, and I'd like to be sure before I spend more money.

I'd suggest that you try to increase the "Grid trickle feed" setting, maybe even to 100W and see whether this stabilises things, what obviously is happening is that the PrePaid meter is seeing power into the grid from the inverter and disconnecting you, luckily only for a short period, the other option would be to talk to the Municipality and see whether they'd change the settings on the pre-paid meter to prevent the disconnect but still charge you for the power the inverter sends to the grid, this way it would be in your best interest to try and prevent this from happening in the 1st place...

Is the CT Coil installed facing the correct way?

As others have suggested, use a 100W "Grid Trickle feed" and reduce to 50W, then 20W.
I use 20W, but did start at 40W.

EDIT: What are your shutdown settings?

Other suggestions:
from hubble lithium recommendations https://www.hubblelithium.co.za/sunsynk :
This used to be 53.6V, but the web page now says 53.8V.


The below will allow the invert to use grid to maintain the SoC/V:

✓ = Charge from Grid
No Tick = Discharge - IIRC, this is to load shift (battery) to the grid.

Edited December 18, 20223 yr by system32

Now I’m starting to wonder whether I should be installing an inverter setup at my place🤦‍♂️
 

1 hour ago, Wepd said:

Now I’m starting to wonder whether I should be installing an inverter setup at my place🤦‍♂️

The SunSynk/Deye are great Hybrid inverters, which are very versatile, but with versatility comes many settings and complexity.
Unfortunately some installers are not familiar with the device.
Took me a while to get the settings I use and a lot of time on powerforum.

Edited December 18, 20223 yr by system32

On 2022/12/17 at 11:16 AM, BlakeSA said:

Howdy people.

 

Hopefully there's a guru on here that can help me out here. I'm frustrated and confused and not sure if the issue is with me, the settings on my inverter...or possibly an installation fault.

 

SYSTEM:

• 1x Sunsynk 5kW Hybrid Inverter 
• 1x Hubble AM-2 48V 5.5KWh battery
• 12x JaSolar 545 panels

 

HISTORY:

Chapter 1: Fancy UPS

Had the inverter and Battery installed in August 2022 as a load shedding UPS.

Worked like a charm.

 

• Non-Essential circuit: Geyser, Stove, Oven
• Essential circuit: Everything else

 

A bit risky with only a 5kW inverter, but we managed it carefully and tried not to generate peak loads of more that 5kW during load shedding and 6.5kW outside of load shedding.

 

Battery was charging fine when grid power came back and life was lekker. No complicated settings on the inverter, nothing. Everything just worked, unless we accidentally generated a load that was too big.

 

Chapter 2: Going Solar

In order to try and recoup some of the costs of the inverter and battery I decided to invest in some solar panels. I also figured it would be good for battery health in the long term as the UPS implementation only got the SOC down to 70-80% in a 2 hour loadshed during the day or at worst 45% during a 4 hour Stage 6 stint.

 

So, panels were installed, CT coil was installed (I hope correctly) and hooked up to the inverter. The setup I requested was for excess PV production to be sent to the essential circuit in the house as well as the non-essential circuit to heat the geyser during the day and everything worked initially.

 

THE PROBLEM:

But then some bugs emerged. I’m not sure how to describe it, but in certain conditions (that I am struggling to narrow down) the grid disconnects for a minute or two and reconnects for a couple of seconds and disconnects again for a minute or two. The essential circuit is fine (lights flicker now and then) but the non-essential circuit goes nuts and my oven beeps every time the grid connection comes back and then goes off again a couple of seconds later. I can also hear the inverter clicking on and off during these cycles. None of this can be good for the system so I’m desperate to figure it out and fix the problem. 

 

THEORIES

1. Synsynk and my installer say it's due to issues with grid stability, so that is theory. I’m not sure I buy that, because I’m able to get things working when I tinker with the System Mode functions. More on that later.
2. I think the issue is down to something causing a conflict in the inverter settings...but I'm a noob and don't understand half of the options in the inverter menu. But by playing with the settings I can get things to kind-off work again…even if not the way I want it to work.
3. There is another theory. I’m reluctant to mention it just yet, but my inverter is significantly further from the mains than the recommended 10m…it’s about 25 away. So I guess this could also be part of the problem, although the installer claims he’s installed other systems more than 10m away without issues.

 

PHOTOS AND SETTINGS:

Battery:

Battery Type settings:

I changed the charge amps to 30A myself. Installer had both at 100A, but saw on this forum and then checked on the Hubble site where it said 30A charge is recommended.

Battery Charge setting:

Not sure what all these settings mean. I just disabled Grid Charge while I was fiddling.

Since I'm charging from PV I don't think it should make a difference? If I were to want to grid charge because of a cloudy day's low production I'd just tick that box.

 

And here is my Use Timer settings for reference.

I'll post the settings in another post as the images are limited.

 

I sent you a pm with my number.I have an almost identical system except mine is the 8 kw sunsynk.

We can compare notes.Give me a shout on 0726025119

Thanks for all the suggestions folk. You really are a great bunch.

I've had a relatively quiet 3 days with no persistent issues. I had just one disconnect and reconnect event. The disconnect lasted for less than 10 seconds and the inverter and battery backup handled it like a champ.

Thanks for all the advice @system32 & @Kalahari Meerkat

Some feedback, the CT Coil is definitely installed correctly - I just checked. The values are positive, and the value is usually close to my current trickle feed of 20W...but they do fluctuate. Usually between 16W-29W but I've seen them hit 0W as well. It's not inconceivable to me that it might spike into the negative from time to time as well, although I haven't seem it myself.

This is why I am also suspecting that, due to the distance between my CT Coil and Inverter there are brief "spikes" where the signal is too slow and the inverter just sends a little too much juice to the Non-Essential circuit for a brief moment and this then causes the meter to get hit and disconnect.

Only 2 issues with this theory:

1. When I have a disconnect, the meter stays on. When I have load shedding it switches off. So the meter itself isn't shutting down. There are also no errors or anything on the pre-paid meter itself.

2. According to my installer, many meters that receive a reverse power flow shut down permanently and somebody from the city then needs to reboot it. Apparently some kind of tamper safeguard. That isn't happening to me, but I have quite an old meter, so made it doesn't that? I dunno.

Either way; I think boosting the trickle feed to 50W might be a way to test only 1 variable and see if it makes a difference, but as I said, things have been stable for the last 3 days without changing anything. I want to keep the experiments as controlled as possible and not implement all the recommended settings at once.

On 2022/12/18 at 12:08 PM, system32 said:

EDIT: What are your shutdown settings?

Shutdown 10%

Low Batt 15%

Restart 20%

Those were the installer settings, I haven't really tinkered there at all and the Sunsynk user manual hasn't been very useful in explaining what they mean. But non-of the disconnect-reconnect loops I've experienced have been close to those levels. The lowest SOC setting allowed by my Use Time is 30% between 05:00-09:00 and being in Cape Town, my PV is starting to produce at around 06:00 already.

On 2022/12/18 at 12:08 PM, system32 said:

The below will allow the invert to use grid to maintain the SoC/V:

✓ = Charge from Grid
No Tick = Discharge - IIRC, this is to load shift (battery) to the grid.

Thanks for that. I keep Grid unchecked because I want to recoup as much cost from my investment as possible and not grid charge my battery if I can avoid it. My PV setup is working a treat in summer and juicing up the battery nicely. I think I just need one more 5kW battery unit and I'll be golden. Right now I'm just hitting those SOC caps about an hour or so before the end of the time window and pulling about 3W from Eskom between sunset and sunrise every night.

On 2022/12/18 at 3:32 PM, Wepd said:

Now I’m starting to wonder whether I should be installing an inverter setup at my place🤦‍♂️
 

Don't let my experience put you off. The systems are amazing and really are life changing. Even with my small issue, I don't regret the investment for a second.

99% of the time it has been smooth sailing and we are loving not even having to check Load shedding schedules anymore.

It's just this one little, intermittent bug that is causing some frustration and it might just be due to my slightly unorthodox installation requirement.

If you can afford to do it, don't delay.

Edited December 21, 20223 yr by BlakeSA

1 hour ago, BlakeSA said:

Thanks for all the suggestions folk. You really are a great bunch.

I've had a relatively quiet 3 days with no persistent issues. I had just one disconnect and reconnect event. The disconnect lasted for less than 10 seconds and the inverter and battery backup handled it like a champ.

Thanks for all the advice @system32 & @Kalahari Meerkat

Some feedback, the CT Coil is definitely installed correctly - I just checked. The values are positive, and the value is usually close to my current trickle feed of 20W...but they do fluctuate. Usually between 16W-29W but I've seen them hit 0W as well. It's not inconceivable to me that it might spike into the negative from time to time as well, although I haven't seem it myself.

This is why I am also suspecting that, due to the distance between my CT Coil and Inverter there are brief "spikes" where the signal is too slow and the inverter just sends a little too much juice to the Non-Essential circuit for a brief moment and this then causes the meter to get hit and disconnect.

Only 2 issues with this theory:

1. When I have a disconnect, the meter stays on. When I have load shedding it switches off. So the meter itself isn't shutting down. There are also no errors or anything on the pre-paid meter itself.

2. According to my installer, many meters that receive a reverse power flow shut down permanently and somebody from the city then needs to reboot it. Apparently some kind of tamper safeguard. That isn't happening to me, but I have quite an old meter, so made it doesn't that? I dunno.

Either way; I think boosting the trickle feed to 50W might be a way to test only 1 variable and see if it makes a difference, but as I said, things have been stable for the last 3 days without changing anything. I want to keep the experiments as controlled as possible and not implement all the recommended settings at once.

Shutdown 10%

Low Batt 15%

Restart 20%

Those were the installer settings, I haven't really tinkered there at all and the Sunsynk user manual hasn't been very useful in explaining what they mean. But non-of the disconnect-reconnect loops I've experienced have been close to those levels. The lowest SOC setting allowed by my Use Time is 30% between 05:00-09:00 and being in Cape Town, my PV is starting to produce at around 06:00 already.

Thanks for that. I keep Grid unchecked because I want to recoup as much cost from my investment as possible and not grid charge my battery if I can avoid it. My PV setup is working a treat in summer and juicing up the battery nicely. I think I just need one more 5kW battery unit and I'll be golden. Right now I'm just hitting those SOC caps about an hour or so before the end of the time window and pulling about 3W from Eskom between sunset and sunrise every night.

Charging from grid only happens if the SoC is below the SoC/V.
This "negative" only happens if there has been load shedding or if the SoC/V value is higher for the next period.
Eg in your table, at 13:00, if the SoC is below 80%, grid will be used.

Edited December 21, 20223 yr by system32

My Settings if it will help for Grid

 

What prepaid meter do you have 

which area are you in.

 

chances are you hitting peak allocated amps from grid and prepaid meter is disconnecting for a short period. Or meter is picking up reverse current.

if your non essential items, oven, geysers etc disconnects when the ac light goes off on inverter Its your prepaid meter supply and not the inverter thats causing it. (Not the control unit in the house.) most cui devices have a backup battery in it as well so the prepaid meter interface will have power for a while even when supply drops for a bit.
if pushing back current to non essential load is getting incorrect readings from the CT the meter might be going into protection for a short period. Test by switching off solar inputs and time of use all at 100%

Another way to test would be to switch off the geyser on the mains. Once loadsh1tting finishes. The time of use will pull power to charge batteries together with any non essential items and this might be too high draw for prepaid meter power allocated to you.

some suppliers will give a code to enable higher peak draw.

test non essential load and see that it matches the ct coil readings.eg. Use a hairdryer on non essential side and essential side and confirm power draw is showing on the inverter.  And ct coil readings match up.

Any progress?

Good day,

I have the same exact system, minus the solar panels. This morning, we wake up with no grid power. Non-essentials (oven and guyser), are off. 

There is no loadshedding but the system is behaving as if there is loadshedding. Somehow grid power is not coming through. I noticed that the prepaid meter is no longer blinking and the units are not being depleted.

 

Any solution to this, Literally the exact same issue, random disconnects especially while discharging battery at night?

It could be that the grid became unstable and outside of the parameters under the grid settings. Just a theory.

1 hour ago, GreenFields said:

It could be that the grid became unstable and outside of the parameters under the grid settings. Just a theory.

I was about to say. 

My inverter is a different brand, but I suspect some general principles apply. 

My inverter constantly monitors the grid connection. Not just there or not there, but checking that the voltage is within a set range and that frequency doesn't deviate much from 50Hz.

If the incoming power goes out of range then the inverter does not accept that power. It keeps on monitoring and will reconnect when it deems the supply to be within range. 

During this time it will  only send power to the backed up circuits and will use batteries and/or PV to do that. 

I have an app on my phone that I use to monitor the inverter. It will show me what is available on the input side, and what it is sending to the backed up circuits. 

If @Sello Mapota or @VinceG has that sort of app, they can check the incoming voltage when they notice this behavior. Also it's likely that the inverter keeps error logs. Finally, if you have a fairly recent meter, it will display the incoming voltage.