53 minutes ago, DeepBass9 said:

you are ingesting a whole lot of glyphosate

Aaah yes, but that is why I brought up half-life and whether it is systemic. If it is systemic, it might build up in the soil, and if it has a relatively long halflife, it might take too long to break down. Glyphosate breaks down in soil in about two months and is not systemic. All studies done so far indicates it is not poisonous to humans (you need more than 1mg per kilogram of body weight) and it is also not carcinogenic.

Of course this does not mean you can throw caution to the wind. Of course there's still risk involved, and there might be things we don't understand yet. But I don't think we're ingesting all that much glyphosate at all. Tests have found that in corn (which is apparently one of the worse ones) it's about 6.5 parts in a million, and this exceeds the 5ppm approved by the American FDA.

Can a little but of glyphosate harm us? I don't know. But what would be very interesting is to see how much other cr*p (natural and man-made) we live with... completely oblivious to its effects. Like stuff in our drinking water that gets past the purifying plants...

Put your tin foil hat firmly on your head and read some of the 'conspiracies'. Then read about the paid Monsanto shills, trolls and pet academics who put out the 'research' you are quoting. Bayer isn't paying up $2 billion for no reason. There is a lot more to this than is visible on the surface, and the reason behind all of the fake information? Corporate profits surprise, surprise.

Consider this for a moment, the traditional picture of a mielie farmer is a guy with a straw hat and a hoe out in the field. Drive past a mielie field now and there is nothing growing there anymore. Just bare earth and gmo mielies. That is scary.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/jun/02/monsanto-manipulates-journalists-academics

https://monsanto.com/company/outreach/stem-education/articles/academic-partnerships/

hook, line and sinker?

 

Edited July 12, 20197 yr by DeepBass9

14 minutes ago, DeepBass9 said:

Drive past a mielie field now and there is nothing growing there anymore. Just bare earth and gmo mielies. That is scary.

What got me was when my cousin, a farmer, told me that they have to buy seed every year from then Monsanto via the Ko-op's as they cannot keep part of the crop back for next years seed.

GMO has a place but with corporations after profit, no thank you. 

14 minutes ago, DeepBass9 said:

Put your tin foil hat firmly on your head and read some of the 'conspiracies'.

I'm 100% behind you on this statement. Having been watching the last decade about what this is/was all about, the recent $2 billion being paid out is a ray of sunshine in this "dark cupboard".

Edited July 12, 20197 yr by Guest

The Corps and their statistics reminds me of: Lies. Damn Lies. Statistics.

 

What has changed that has caused this scourge of modern 'lifestyle diseases'? Here's a hint :

 

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4392553/

Glyphosate, pathways to modern diseases III: Manganese, neurological diseases, and associated pathologies

Abstract

Manganese (Mn) is an often overlooked but important nutrient, required in small amounts for multiple essential functions in the body. A recent study on cows fed genetically modified Roundup^®-Ready feed revealed a severe depletion of serum Mn. Glyphosate, the active ingredient in Roundup^®, has also been shown to severely deplete Mn levels in plants. Here, we investigate the impact of Mn on physiology, and its association with gut dysbiosis as well as neuropathologies such as autism, Alzheimer's disease (AD), depression, anxiety syndrome, Parkinson's disease (PD), and prion diseases. Glutamate overexpression in the brain in association with autism, AD, and other neurological diseases can be explained by Mn deficiency. Mn superoxide dismutase protects mitochondria from oxidative damage, and mitochondrial dysfunction is a key feature of autism and Alzheimer’s. Chondroitin sulfate synthesis depends on Mn, and its deficiency leads to osteoporosis and osteomalacia. Lactobacillus, depleted in autism, depend critically on Mn for antioxidant protection. Lactobacillus probiotics can treat anxiety, which is a comorbidity of autism and chronic fatigue syndrome. Reduced gut Lactobacillus leads to overgrowth of the pathogen, Salmonella, which is resistant to glyphosate toxicity, and Mn plays a role here as well. Sperm motility depends on Mn, and this may partially explain increased rates of infertility and birth defects. We further reason that, under conditions of adequate Mn in the diet, glyphosate, through its disruption of bile acid homeostasis, ironically promotes toxic accumulation of Mn in the brainstem, leading to conditions such as PD and prion diseases.

Like Monsanto / Bayer, I see some drama heading towards big oil because they are also speaking with a forked tongue.

Attempts to 'erase the science' at UN climate talks

From here: Climate realpolitik: South Africa’s ‘secret’ and ‘confidential’ slide to the wrong side of history By Kevin Bloom• 12 July 2019

I for one look forward to global warming. I don't like the cold, and neither do polar bears.

3 hours ago, DeepBass9 said:

Then read about the paid Monsanto shills, trolls and pet academics who put out the 'research' you are quoting

I don't buy it. That was an FDA report. That report actually said there was MORE bad stuff in the corn than allowed. If I was paying someone to supres the truth, I'd be asking for my money back. It is not only the FDA, also the WHO and the European institutions too. Apparently in the 2016-2017 tests the FDA did 53% of the stuff they checked had no glyphosate traces in it at all... (but the corn was particularly bad). Traces. Traces does not necessarily mean bad.

Every single newspaper article I google into claims that Glyphosate was linked with cancer. It was not. Not even remotely. Which again doesn't mean it's all okay and you can throw caution to the wind either. The truth is somewhere in the middle, that is to say, I don't really fully trust either side of the debate at this point.

Edited July 12, 20197 yr by plonkster

In 2014 The Netherlands banned the sale of Glyphosate to civilians. But not to commercial buyers. This is the sort of thing @Bobster spoke about. That means nothing really changes. The guy using small amounts in his own garden, he can't. The big commercial farmer spraying it all over your food? You bet!

3 hours ago, plonkster said:

Every single newspaper article I google into claims that Glyphosate was linked with cancer. It was not.

I think this was the 1st cancer case that Monsato lost because of the use of Roundup by a school groundskeeper - SCHOOL groundskeeper - let that sink in. 🙂 

The man who beat Monsanto: 'They have to pay for not being honest'

Monsanto found liable for California man's cancer and ordered to pay $80m in damages

Edited July 12, 20197 yr by Guest

Here is some more, just in: 

Are You Eating Corn The Mice Rejected?

From here: Farmer Conducts Experiment Using GMO and Non-GMO Corn, Discovers Sobering Truth

30 minutes ago, The Terrible Triplett said:

Here is some more, just in: 

Are You Eating Corn The Mice Rejected?

i told you guys, stay off the carbs 🤣

22 hours ago, plonkster said:

Every single newspaper article I google into claims that Glyphosate was linked with cancer.

everything seems to be linked to cancer - and even if the big C wont get you, the big D [death] will for sure 😎

23 hours ago, The Terrible Triplett said:

Here is some more, just in: 

Are You Eating Corn The Mice Rejected?

From here: Farmer Conducts Experiment Using GMO and Non-GMO Corn, Discovers Sobering Truth

Lol, I have planted heritage maize varieties and the monkeys just destroy them. Meantime there are 100s of hectares or gmo maize standing in the fields around me, but monkeys won't eat it. I gave up eventually.

Edited July 13, 20197 yr by DeepBass9

Guys, if you avoid GMOs, and they are harmless then nothing lost. If all the warnings are true, then you dodged a bullet.

Edited July 13, 20197 yr by DeepBass9

2 hours ago, DeepBass9 said:

monkeys won't eat it

now that is an evolutionary conundrum if ever there was one... 🤣

Didnt take much for the 3rd force counter revolutionary double agents to move this topic from badmouthing Eishkom to how God owns shares in Monsanto 

 

😁😁😁😁😁😁😁😁😁😁😁😁😁😁😁😁😁

On 2019/07/12 at 7:38 PM, The Terrible Triplett said:

I think this was the 1st cancer case that Monsato lost because of the use of Roundup by a school groundskeeper - SCHOOL groundskeeper - let that sink in. 🙂 

The man who beat Monsanto: 'They have to pay for not being honest'

Monsanto found liable for California man's cancer and ordered to pay $80m in damages

These cases almost always center on the labeling of the product. The company didn't properly put warnings on the product, and so they must pay up. This article says that the Jury found them guilty, it is unclear if it was a civil or a ciminal matter (probably civil).

In any case, the scientific consensus for the moment remains that  glyphosate is probably NOT carcinogenic and has low toxicity for humans. There exists no plausible mechanism and no statistical data to prove it. The one paper I looked at (just now) is a meta-study over 14 other studies done by various different groups.

I'm not saying that "therefore roundup is okay". I hate both the indiscriminate adding of chemicals AND the conspiracy no-more-than-anecdotal-evidence people at the other end (essentially the same thing as you see with anti-vaxers).

But the monkeys...............

20 hours ago, plonkster said:

... conspiracy no-more-than-anecdotal-evidence ...

Do you have shares in or are you working with / for Bayer/Monsanto or are you paid to confuse the issue on glyphosate? 😂

Just like the cigarette Exec lied to the USA congress that smoking is not bad for you, with "medical evidence" presented.

And still their are the monkeys ... if animals are used in testing what is safe for human consumption and monkey's are not touching GMO maize ... with the profits involved, I severely question the studies saying glyphosate is safe when consume over a human's lifetime.

Can I stop it? Probably not.

Bottom line for me: Do. Not. Genetically. Add. Glyphosate. Into. Our. Food chain..

14 minutes ago, The Terrible Triplett said:

Do you have shares in or are you working with / for Bayer/Monsanto or are you paid to confuse the issue on glyphosate? 😂

Nope 🙂

14 minutes ago, The Terrible Triplett said:

Just like the cigarette Exec lied to the USA congress that smoking is not bad for you, with "medical evidence" presented.

Not the same, if anything it makes my case. There is clear statistical correlation as well as a mechanism that explains the smoking/cancer link. There is none (yet?) for glyphosate.

14 minutes ago, The Terrible Triplett said:

Do. Not. Genetically. Add. Glyphosate. Into. Our. Food chain

I think you are confusing the two issues. What these clever people are doing (and I am thinking of that scene in Jurasic Park where Jeff Goldblum says that they are too busy thinking about what they CAN do that they didn't think about whether they should, so don't get me wrong), is to engineer plants that are immune to the herbicide(s). That's where the genetic stuff comes in. Here I agree, this is more dangerous territory. But it is the other side of the coin. There is nothing genetic about glyphosate. It's a fairly simple chemical that disrupts photosynthesis in plants.

Edited July 15, 20197 yr by plonkster

On a side note... I read the other day that farmers are now using drone technology for targeted application of herbicide. I really really like this. They don't spray everything indiscriminately. They literally spray only the weeds. Saves money and means less chemicals in the food. This is the sort of thing we should be doing...

11 minutes ago, plonkster said:

It's a fairly simple chemical that disrupts photosynthesis in plants

I agree with @plonksterabout the risk of herbicides. I am much more concerned about the farmers spraying our food with pesticides.

1 minute ago, Fuenkli said:

spraying our food with pesticides

Yup. And engineering pest-resistance into the plant by splicing things into the DNA. That scares me a LOT more. That's playing god*.

* Capitalisation. So if you grew up in my time, you were taught certain things about using capital letters, but there is an easy English rule: If it is used as a noun, it's lower-case. If it is used as a proper name, then you capitalise it, even if you think Zeus doesn't exist 🙂.

48 minutes ago, plonkster said:

On a side note... I read the other day that farmers are now using drone technology for targeted application of herbicide. I really really like this. They don't spray everything indiscriminately. They literally spray only the weeds. Saves money and means less chemicals in the food. This is the sort of thing we should be doing...

Yup, unfortunately it is generally done with machines like this:

 

The drones are used for mapping, not neccessarily application as you can see the volumes required are too large for a drone.

Edited July 15, 20197 yr by DeepBass9