I have found this extract from a Webinar held in November:

https://arepenergy.co.za/city-of-cape-town-webinar-nov-2019/

 

14 minutes ago, PaBz0r said:

I have found this extract from a Webinar held in November:

https://arepenergy.co.za/city-of-cape-town-webinar-nov-2019/

 

Just reading through this again, I again marvel at the terminology and how it boggles the minds even of people who know this stuff. Off-grid SSEG? SSEG == Small Scale Embedded Generator. The question would be: Embedded into what? Well, embedded into the grid of course. So "Off-grid SSEG" is somewhat of a contradiction in terms.

On 2020/01/17 at 3:46 PM, plonkster said:

Just reading through this again, I again marvel at the terminology and how it boggles the minds even of people who know this stuff. Off-grid SSEG? SSEG == Small Scale Embedded Generator. The question would be: Embedded into what? Well, embedded into the grid of course. So "Off-grid SSEG" is somewhat of a contradiction in terms.

Exactly, they keep on mixing it up which causes confusion. I am glad they again talked about the software/hardware limiting, so this gives a path to have a 5kVA Multiplus, instead of losing out with the 3kVA on a 60A supply.

I haven't had the guts to contact my metering agents to hear about an upgrade to 80A yet.. They might look at my bill and reckon I can go fly a kite or get a bit funny about it, as it is still unclear when and how Tshwane is going to implement everything.

After some 15 months dealing with COCT my system is finally connected and feeding power into the grid.

About 10KWp has been added since yesterday.

A Landis and Gyr E650 meter has been installed by COCT (I had to pay for it). Does anybody know how to read the damn thing ? It has been parameterized by COCT so the manual is of little use. It's wireless and I can see the readings on COCT's website but there are around 12 values displayed with no hint what each means. So far all queries to COCT have met with silence. 

Anybody know the answer ? 

15 months 🙄  That is a ridiculous amount of time to wait.

1 hour ago, admiral said:

15 months 🙄  That is a ridiculous amount of time to wait.

They called me last week to upgrade the prepaid meter. I then had to explain that since May last year when this started... I actually sold the house and moved. Since the sign-off was never completed, it did not make sense to file an official decommissioning. So my case is now a big spanner in the works that confuses a heck of a lot of people...

3 hours ago, plonkster said:

They called me last week to upgrade the prepaid meter. I then had to explain that since May last year when this started... I actually sold the house and moved. Since the sign-off was never completed, it did not make sense to file an official decommissioning. So my case is now a big spanner in the works that confuses a heck of a lot of people...

Yes I can see that happening.

The process does not seem flexible or allow for deviations from the straight and narrow. You also have to keep checking up and basically make a nuisance of yourself in order to get things done. 

How long does it then take, from the first piece of paper, until connecting to the grid?

34 minutes ago, admiral said:

How long does it then take, from the first piece of paper, until connecting to the grid?

it took me 9 month. But I had the >3.5kVA problem. I think now it would be quicker. 

On 2020/02/28 at 3:51 PM, admiral said:

How long does it then take, from the first piece of paper, until connecting to the grid?

About 15 months in my case. But it is for a big system and I tried to get them to accept the Victron Multplus fitted with Ziehl relay for the NRS-097 compliance part. That turned out to be a no-go much to my consternation and I had to implement an alternative that used a gird-tie for the solar part and then use the Victrons as UPS so that took a bit of time. There were some other hold ups - one of them was that I had to downgrade my 150A three phase feed to 100A as they wanted me to go onto a commercial tariff (never mind that I was on a normal household tariff before). The commercial tariff however is so badly skewed in COCT's favor it would have cost me a fortune in daily charges with no hope of ever producing enough Solar power to offset that. Anyway, all is now sorted eventually.

I worked out that I need to feed in around three times the power I take at night to break even on an annualized bases. My batteries are still in as new condition but they are now no longer utilized except during load shedding. 

I have a lot of scope left now to tweak the system if needed (for example I could still supply just the base load from batteries at night) as well as add up to another 5 or 6KW worth of panels. But that is future - right now the system is running real sweet.

It took them 9 months to approve my small/simple off grid DC-only system (finally got approval in feb); in which there is 0% chance of feedback to the grid because nothing on PV side even connects to the houses wiring.
Given that this should be the absolutely most simple thing for them to process, no complex inverter laws to worry about, its likely this is the 'best case' scenario.

Maybe/hopefully things will speed up once the initial backlog of the forced registration subsides.

22 minutes ago, The Bulldog said:

About 15 months in my case. But it is for a big system and I tried to get them to accept the Victron Multplus fitted with Ziehl relay for the NRS-097 compliance part. That turned out to be a no-go much to my consternation and I had to implement an alternative that used a gird-tie for the solar part and then use the Victrons as UPS so that took a bit of time. There were some other hold ups - one of them was that I had to downgrade my 150A three phase feed to 100A as they wanted me to go onto a commercial tariff (never mind that I was on a normal household tariff before). The commercial tariff however is so badly skewed in COCT's favor it would have cost me a fortune in daily charges with no hope of ever producing enough Solar power to offset that. Anyway, all is now sorted eventually.

I worked out that I need to feed in around three times the power I take at night to break even on an annualized bases. My batteries are still in as new condition but they are now no longer utilized except during load shedding. 

I have a lot of scope left now to tweak the system if needed (for example I could still supply just the base load from batteries at night) as well as add up to another 5 or 6KW worth of panels. But that is future - right now the system is running real sweet.

Hi "Bulldog", I would really like to chat to you about your setup.  I am in the process of designing a 90kVA Victron backup and have also tried to get away with the Ziehl route for compliance (I am using 6 x Quattro 15kVA) but was told it will not fly by CoCT.  I came up with another design that will be approved but I think I can do better, but not sure they will approve it.  It sounds like you will know.  I will really appreciate it if you can drop me your detail to [email protected].  Thanks

1 hour ago, Hannes7212 said:

Hi "Bulldog", I would really like to chat to you about your setup. 

Sent you a PM to your e-mail address.

 

 

On 2020/02/28 at 3:51 PM, admiral said:

How long does it then take, from the first piece of paper, until connecting to the grid?

The summary version:

•  May 2019.  Submitted my application
• September 2019. Inspection of premises
• October 2019. Sign and hand-deliver the required "Supplemental contract" 
• October 2019. Permission to Install letter received.
• Feb 2020. Commissioning approval letter received (dated Jan 2020).

I think that this would have gone a lot slower had I not followed up/queried the progress.

14 hours ago, NigelL said:

 

The summary version:

•  May 2019.  Submitted my application
• September 2019. Inspection of premises
• October 2019. Sign and hand-deliver the required "Supplemental contract" 
• October 2019. Permission to Install letter received.
• Feb 2020. Commissioning approval letter received (dated Jan 2020).

I think that this would have gone a lot slower had I not followed up/queried the progress.

Who can wait 5 months just to get permission to install?  What was the supplemental contract about?

1 hour ago, admiral said:

Who can wait 5 months just to get permission to install?  What was the supplemental contract about?

Honestly, I think they forgot about my application until I followed up with them in September. They quoted me a 2 week turn-around for a decision on the permission to install, in May. I was not in a hurry for the paperwork since the installation was already "completed" prior to the application 😉. 

The City of Cape Town require you to sign a "Supplemental Contract" that basically lays out the rules and options available.

• Max inverter power
• Power Export or Non-export options
• Bi-directional energy meter (if exporting)
• Costs and Tariff structure (depends on whether one chooses to export power)
• If you choose the export option, then you may not feed back more power than you use over any rolling 12 month period.

Edited March 3, 20206 yr by NigelL

On 2020/03/02 at 1:37 PM, mmacleod said:

It took them 9 months to approve my small/simple off grid DC-only system (finally got approval in feb); in which there is 0% chance of feedback to the grid because nothing on PV side even connects to the houses wiring.
Given that this should be the absolutely most simple thing for them to process, no complex inverter laws to worry about, its likely this is the 'best case' scenario.

Maybe/hopefully things will speed up once the initial backlog of the forced registration subsides.

Wow, what does your system entail? 

What was the process? Documents that needed to be sent in and did they then do a site inspection to confirm install?

Thanks

2 minutes ago, Tsa said:

Wow, what does your system entail?

6x320W (1920W) artsolar panels
eSmart MPPT charge controller
1x pylontech US3000 lithium battery
1x 8 port PoE injector
1x victron orion 48/12 DC/DC convertor  
1x victron orion 48/24 DC/DC convertor
(And obviously assorted cabling/connectors/DC circuit breakers)

Most my network equipment runs off the 48v PoE
My desktop computer itself runs directly from the battery at 48v as well (I bought a 48V DC ATX PSU for it)
My two computer monitors run off the 24v convertor
I'm not actually even using the 12v convertor any more (at a point I had some network devices on it still) but I keep it around just in case

This allows me to endure entire day power outages (happens several times a year) uninterrupted, as well as shorter load shedding periods when load shedding flares up. Which is important to me as  a work from home programmer.
So essentially all my computing related equipment is off grid but the rest of my house functions as normal, I don't really care if my oven etc. goes out (though in my next house I'll probably install more panels and move more things off grid)
 

10 minutes ago, Tsa said:

What was the process? Documents that needed to be sent in and did they then do a site inspection to confirm install?

1) Filled in the four page SSEG off grid application form where I could as various of the parts don't apply or make sense.
2) Crossed out all the parts about inverters or that were irrelevant.
3) Put 'n/a' by the CoC part of 'documents to be submitted'
4) Wrote notes on it at various points that the system was DC only and physically seperated from the grid.
5) Hand drew a 'system diagram' of the whole thing
6) Sent them an email of the above, and mentioned in the email that their requirements in terms of system diagram are vague and the I won't pay for an electrician to do all of this unless they first clarify various of the requirements to avoid a double call out.

I then waited about 9 months and in February out of nowhere it was completed, I was never contacted and nobody came to inspect, or if they did I'm not aware of it happening (so its unlikely)

A copy of the 'system diagram', in case it somehow ends up being useful for anyone - not exactly my finest work but I was angry I even had to spend time on this at all so wasn't really going to spend too much time making it pretty.
 

@mmacleod: Thanks for the detailed reply. Much appreciated! 

9 months to get this approved. The mind boggles.

Now I feel a bit better, seems I was not doing too bad...

 

If you take 9 months to get something like that approved - how many people will actually follow this process?!

From a DA mailer received in my inbox this morning. 

• His team is on track to make the Western Cape the first loadshedding-free province in the county, ramping up efforts for everybody to generate and sell renewable power onto the grid.

Hmmmmm, yeah right...
Not like this they are...

 

 

any updates from recent experiences with CoCT here?