fredhen

We've got a solar geyser at our place and I made it quite simple by adding a TDDGT timer in the DB board which turns the geyser on at 5pm and off at 6pm and again from 5am until 6am, but with a low-ish temperature set on the thermostat of 55 degrees. This is simply to ensure that there is warm water in the evenings and in the mornings. If the sun was out in full force and the water temperature is higher than 55 degrees already then the thermostat simply won't switch on the element. I think that's the most basic of basic and cheap configurations to ensure there's warm water, but you can obviously then start looking at Sonoff's with relays and temperature sensors etc. which a lot of people are doing to feed excess solar into the geyser if the batteries are fully charged etc.

This is good thread to follow, thanks!

I'm not 100% sure, but I doubt it as it's only a GUI change in VRM with how information is displayed to you. From what I can see from the release notes for v2.60 of Venus OS there's nothing specific related to the VRM changes.

The Powerwall comes with a 13.5 kWh battery that can be 100% discharged and an inverter that can do 5kW continuous and 7kW peak output. By default you can only charge the battery from the grid. If you would like to be able to charge using solar power you will need to also add a separate 5kW PV inverter. In my opinion you can sort of compare it as 4-5 Pylontech US3000 batteries with a Victron Multiplus-II GX 48/5000/70-50. Adding the GX as it also give you the monitoring that you get with the Powerwall although you need to buy a Powerwall Gateway 2 for that if I remember correctly), so it can be similar to a Multi without a GX device, but most people want monitoring. The difference would be that if you would like to charge using solar power then you only need to add MPPT/s which works out quite less than having to add a PV inverter (like the Fronius Primo 5.0-1), but you can also add it as it is supported by the Multi.

An additional point is also that what is generated needs somewhere to go. Do you have any loads on at that time / have batteries charging / allow feedback to the grid? Otherwise it may be possible that it's only generating what is required.

I'm just going to ping @plonkster for this one, but if I remember correctly the 'consensus' was that if the price for the Multi & separate GX compared to the Multi GX is about the same it's worth going for the GX-model. I think he also mentioned the GX in the Multi being the best GX device and even better than the Cebro GX. This I'm not 100% sure on that. But I guess that it's much of a muchness except that if the GX in the Multi fails that it's not as easy as just swapping out the GX. Similar to a EasySolar where a MPPT fails compared to a standalone MPPT failing. To be honest though, yes, there's a chance of that happening, but if you're going blue I think it's a small chance of it happening. From my side I would just go with the Multi with the GX included if the price is similar.

No need to apologize! I just quickly copy pasted it as I happened to have it open. As far as I know the apps are in fact simply displaying the website through the app, so the app is actually just loading up the website.

https://vrm.victronenergy.com

Ah, that changes it. How long does your current batteries last for when used for self consumption? I'm guessing they already easily last through a loadshedding stint? I doubt you'll get a quick ROI if that is what you are after (you definitely won't if it's financed) and your goal doesn't seem to be going as off grid as possible. For you I would say it will most likely not be worth it. Even if you factor in a very conservative 6% Eskom increase a year along with a 3% loss in capacity in the battery (to get to the ~85% SOH after ~1675 cycles mentioned in the report) you'll only reach R15k worth of battery usage after 9 years at 80% DOD on a US2000 (if my quick math is correct). And that's if you run them down to a 20% SOC daily. I think a potential factor to consider would be determining how long your 2x US2000's lasts you when being used for self consumption and if it'll be worth adding another. And like Louis mentioned you can always change the self consumption to not go lower than the percentage needed to easily get you through a loadshedding stint and when we potentially have weeks of non-stop loadshedding next year you can change that to a much higher value or even set it to keep batteries charged which will then cope with an evening and morning loadshedding stint. Yes, it's not exactly part of the question, but that's something that is normally in the back of your mind when figuring out battery capacity (at least for me). It's a nice to have, definitely, but I think most people are after something that will easily cope with a stint of loadshedding along with the added benefit of using it during the evenings and getting more value out of your PV by charging the batteries with it the next day.

Can you please share that once done? That's something I've been meaning to look into.

I think it's best to play it safe and get 2x US3000's. It's about the batteries that should be able to accommodate the peak load of the inverter which is 5500 W / ~115A for that model. The US3000 can peak at 100A and this may void your warranty if that happens. You can pick 2x of them up for R40k from a couple of places although I'm not too sure about shipping costs.

If I remember correctly and based on what I've read before you can't really get away with it as you won't have a warranty on the battery and/or inverter. The reason being that you need a battery that can accommodate for the peak load of the inverter which is 5500W / ~115A. And with an expensive battery you wouldn't really want to play with not having a warranty. Just for the batteries or including the inverter? Because I'm sure you can pick up 2x US3000's for R40k, but if it's along with the Multi I'd suggest extending that hard cap a little bit and getting 2x US2000's then. It looks like you can get the Multi and 2x US2000's for ~R50k. Only another R10k 😅 but if you're planning on extending the bank it's not like you'll sit with too much capacity that'll go to waste. I don't think you can go wrong there. It's well known and supported by the Multi and relatively cheap in comparison to other options out there.

Well I guess an option would be to have a big bank that won't be able to charge from 20% SoC to 100% SoC with the PV available in which case Victron's BatteryLife (if enabled) will kick in. The way I understand it (pretty much pasting from there) is that it will raise the Low SOC limit by 5% each day until it reaches a 85% SoC. It will then stay on that level, but if it reaches 95% then it will lower the Low SOC limit by 5% again. It's not exactly the "ensure 100% once a week" state, but it ensures that it reaches 85% to 100% each day.

Others are also able to blend, but just confirm it as there are some claiming to be Hybrid or whatever the exact term should be, but that definition has lost its meaning and it is now also seen as being able to power from either grid OR PV and not mix grid AND PV. But the Victron inverters like the MultiPlus-II does blend. Is the plan to have all 3x units connected up to the Inverter? I'm guessing that everything will then be on AC Out 1 seeing how each unit has their own meter, DB etc. so it won't be possible to have something like the ovens, geysers etc. on AC Out 2? Although you could of course have yourself on AC Out 1 and then put Skoonma and Tony on AC Out 2 which means that they'll go down when the grid goes down and you'll carry on from the batteries (or just cut Tony as it seems like Skoonma doesn't really have big loads). That's sneaky, but something I'd do as it's most likely not possible to have everyone running off batteries. I think so too, yes. If I have it correctly the MultiPlus-II 5000VA unit can use ~4000W from PV / battery and also blend in another 50A from the grid which is 11 000W at 220V - 12 000W at 240V. You will have to keep in mind that the inverter can only do ~4000W when the grid has failed. Yes, it can spike to 9000W for a second or so, but will generally only handle a maximum constant 4000W or less depending on the temperature. (Which is why I mentioned still giving Tony loadshedding) Just make sure that the batteries that you have are able to reach the 9000W peak of the inverter. The MultiPlus-II can peak at 9000W for example which is 187.5A at 48V. I think the more technically inclined folk like @plonkster & @Jaco de Jongh will be able to answer in more detail and confirm or deny my statements.

That I'm not sure of. The way that I understand it is that it should work similar to how it works now with the LV-Hub becoming the master similar to how it's working at the moment as you can connect to the hub using CAN / RS485. I'm just not sure how exactly it will look and if you will see 12x batteries, 2x groups of batteries or just 1x bank. I think the best would be to ask ICC as I'm sure they would have had installations using the LV-Hub.

Hi Louis, I believe that the Pylontechs can only have 8x in a group. If you want to have more than 8x then you need to make use of their LV-Hub to monitor and control them, so I think at the moment you are only making use of 8x of them. So I guess that you should add in the Pylontech LV-HUB and then split them in 2x groups of 6x which should then allow you to make use of all of them.

https://professional.victronenergy.com/downloads/firmware/ That's where you can get the firmware and it's got instructions as well. https://www.victronenergy.com/live/updating_firmware:updating_ve.bus_products There's also a guide there. The cable is generally available at most solar shops and @Jaco de Jongh can also help you out there. They're pricey though, so if you know someone who might have one it may be best to just borrow it for the day.

Been there, done that, got the T-shirt. To give you an idea of my situation. I have been permanently working from home since April last year (and now my wife joined me from March) and I was in exactly the same boat as you where I essentially only need something to get me through loadshedding, but with the idea (when funds allows) to go bigger and get a proper inverter, battery & pv in the end. After a ton of discussions here on the forum and with some friends I ended up getting one of the portable trolleys over a proper inverter and batteries or a generator. In my case this 2400VA Mecer one with the 100Ah AGM Deep Cycle batteries (which are Vision 100Ah 6FM100 batteries). I did this mainly because after doing the calculations on what I would need at the end of the rabbit hole I realized I should save quite a bit more and it's easier to have a portable inverter that's always on that immediately takes over without dropping power compared to a generator that needs to be started up, is noisy and needs a bit more TLC than sealed batteries. That was a quick win for me (was R8800 at the time) and it's been keeping me going through loadshedding for the last year and a bit. In my case I have a TV, 2x routers, NAS, Pihole, 2x laptops with 2x monitors each and my gaming PC hooked up to the inverter (although the PC is generally not used in loadshedding, but helps for power failures). It started off being a messy extension cord + network cable running together through the house to the home office, but later on had a friend over who helped getting it there neatly be running the cables in separate conduits up the outside wall into the roof and into the home office. We just added 2x cheap lamps with led lights to have light in the TV room and the office at night time and we've had no issues with loadshedding (even the extended Johannesburg 7 hours due to trips days). I'm just mentioning it as an option, because like I said it was a quick win to beat loadshedding without really breaking the bank and as the batteries won't really last I would guess more than 5 years it gives me time to save up to then get a proper 48V inverter with LiFePO4 batteries & pv later which sounds like the same as what you are planning with your setup. As you've got the mini fridge & fish tank you'll need a pure sine wave inverter, so the modified inverter like I've got won't work. Something like this Mecer Axpert Type 3kVa inverter with (I'm guessing) the same Vision batteries should do the trick as long as you don't go over the recommended discharge Amps of the batteries although depending on the Watts used you might need 200Ah batteries as you mentioned (although you'll need a different trolley as they're bigger than the 100Ah batteries). I'm just linking them as that's where I got mine and that's an easy comparison, but you'll need to take delivery into account if you can't collect it. If you are going to stay in the same house for when you hit the rabbit hole and really want your lights to also be on the inverter then I think your plan is also fine to then do a split in your DB to have your lights and the required plugs on the Inverter to keep it going during loadshedding, but it might cost you a bit more initially, but it is a start to the greater scheme in any case. Or you can start with a trolley like setup for now to beat loadshedding (which magically disappeared now) and then when you decide to add some solar panels into the mix later you can get the same person who'll do the solar panels' installation to also mount the inverter to the wall (use the same trolley for the batteries) and do the DB rewire to get you started in that sense. I know nothing about the Axpert / Voltronic inverters and I'm too lazy to read up on it now, but I'm guessing that you should be able to add some solar panels to run the loads during the day and keep the batteries as a backup only for loadshedding, so you might get some more use out of the inverter and batteries after adding solar panels before pulling the trigger to replace both. (Again, not 100% sure about that, so someone should correct me if that's wrong)

I believe this was the case here as the electrician disconnected the neutrals from the busbar to find the one causing a leak between with the earth. After that he managed to easily find the live and determine the breaker that it's connected to and confirmed it as being the cause by switching everything except that one on and keeping the neutral disconnected from the busbar. Then the plug tester came out to determine which plugs are linked to it, but when I walked into the house I could hear the small inverter for the home office still running off battery power, so they tested the plugs in that area and found 3 that are on the breaker and opened them up to find the one causing the problem. That must be a pain.

I'm not 100% sure, but I actually believe that was the case. He did show it to me, but it was dark and I was just anxious to get everything working again Yes, the plugs have plastic cover plates. I've had a look at it again and everything is after the RCD, so with the RCD now actually working I can simply wire it like @plonkster mentioned.

Thanks for the help on this everyone. Had an electrician over this afternoon who quickly wired the RCD correctly and found an issue on one of the plug circuits that would have caused the RCD to trip, quickly tested some plugs and found one where the cover's screw was making contact causing it to short, fixed that and now I can start to relax.

Is 6mm fine? I was under the impression that I'll need to use 16mm or at least 10mm. I was actually going to start a thread about the fuse being required according to the documentation on Victron's site, but got so preoccupied with this db wiring that I forgot about it. Thank you for answering that! I was pleasantly surprised when I walked in and saw the row blanks on the board considering the amount of breakers already in there. Even if there is something like a oven or geyser in front of it and not connecting through it. I'm guessing it'll pick everything up then and not just what is flowing through it? (It's not relevant now as everything is going through the RCD, but just thinking about it for future)

That's part of the reason why I opened it up as I saw the ET112 only support DIN rails, so I luckily already asked Jaco to add an adapter for me. I'm going off topic now, but it's my thread, so I'll allow it. Will it be a problem if it's not wired that way though? As it's not my place and I'll take it with when moving I'd prefer it if it's at the end of the rail along with the geyser timer. I get that the wiring will be a bit more tricky though. I generally agree with that. The only reason why I got it was that the early morning and late evening showers didn't have enough warm water from sun alone in the winter, so I've only got it just so that it warms up enough in the mornings before the sun takes care of the rest during the day and then top up when the sun goes down. I've luckily got a long DB board with another 6 slots open at the end and as the timer takes 2 I'm think the meter should fit. Same here. And wow. It's an understatement if I say that I'm pretty stressed out about this now.

So that explains it then. Although what is happening is that the larger LED lamps in the bathroom tends to slowly fade over 2-3 seconds after switching it off. Maybe also explain the amount of GU10's that have had to have been replaced. Yeah, I think I'll just mention that one as well. That's not a scary thought at all. Thanks again everyone. I was hoping to wait until I have the meter to ask the electrician to also wire that for me, but I'm guessing it's better to just do it as soon as possible. At least then I know everything is OK.

Thank you @plonkster I'll contact the landlord and ask him to get someone out. Is it just luck that everything's been OK for the ~6 months we've been here so far? The element for the roof mounted solar geyser runs off that 20A double-pole breaker. It's getting its live in from one of the 20A breakers hooked up to the busbar which seemed strange, but I guess that way it also runs through the RCD (if it was connected properly).