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Thank you for the great forum, Safe Driving over the weekend. Sincerely Jason

introverter

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introverter last won the day on June 21

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  1. Neither used nor installed. Any of the inverters should probably handle the peak loads but heating a pre-cooked meal in the microwave while quickly blowdrying the hair could have some unintended blackouts on the 3kW inverters I would think (especially if the fridge/freezer decides to do some special murphy's law type synchronised firing up the compressor). If mum is okay with being aware of the things "plugged in" or generaly fine to know "ah yes, should have waited before dryinhg my hair..oh well" it should not be a major issue. With everything on the "want to power list" for 4 and/or 8 hours your problem will be battery capacity (granted that likely not all loads/appliances will be used every time there is an 8 hour outage.. but who knows?) Bluenova kit has 2800Wh capacity, the Pylontech based systems have 2400Wh capacity (neither the bluenova or pylontechs will have all of that number useable). (Wish load) 500W x 4 hours ~ 2000Wh (bluenova does a bit better here than pylontech) (Wish load) 500W x 8 hours ~ 4000Wh (neither will get you to the finish line) With the 5kW inverter you might want to confirm whether having only the one pylontech battery affects the inverter warranty. If seriously thinking about adding solar at some stage keep in mind the current mine field of what may legally be connected to the grid and what not (even if not having any intention to feed back to the grid)... I suspect all the mentioned systems could run into problems there. By the way, the bluenova is a 24V system and the growatt/kodak ones are 48V. If doing a similar system with lead acid batteries it could be cheaper on initial cost than lithium based systems. For load shedding specific application, where depending on the stage of load shedding you could have multiple sessions in one day, I think lead acid battery life can be cut short a bit if the time available for charging requires a high charge current or the battery is repeatedly undercharged because of a charge interruption due to the next stage of load shedding. Space required on lead acids will be roughly double. Should you want/need to replace the bluenova LiFePO4 batteries you will potentially have to use exactly the same type of "lead acid drop-in replacement" batteries since 24V lithium battery options are not that plentiful (they do exist - pylontech actually has a 24V battery and amongst others bluenova and freedomwon produce the mentioned drop-in replacements).
  2. With those loads already probably pushing the apparent surge capacity, other than wanting to know why it happens on battery vs PV, it might not be worth it if it risks releasing the magic smoke from either the inverter or a workshop machine..... current state of the world makes sourcing parts bit of a gamble?
  3. Don't know about ICC and the likes (watchpower?) but with the victron VRM a lot of the info that you don't see is logged (things like overload alarms, battery voltage etc.) and much of that info will be too quick - even for a fluke - but the info might be there somewhere..
  4. At the risk of pitch forks and flame throwers, while @plonkster's post is probably aimed at installers/"system sellers" it is potentially alienating to someone new indicating their interest to learn and wanting to figure something out?
  5. to check if the battery voltage is dropping you could stick a multi meter on the batteries and see what happens to the voltage when you start one of those big/problematic loads or.. I have no idea between ICC and the inverter who makes the actual decisions so something that could be checked is what happens if you temporarily change the "back to utility" voltage (program 12?) and low battery cut-off voltage (program 29?) to something lower and then see what happens when trying to start the problematic load from battery BUT first check with the more axpert knowledgeable crowd and don't leave that setting low or you will end up with a low battery somewhere when you don't want it. I have seen mention of motor soft starters but have no idea how effective they are and rather spending money towards more inverter/PV is maybe a more worthwhile spend?
  6. Correct, with the batteries in parallel the 100A should not be a problem (as pointed out by @jykenmynie ) so the battery peak should actually not be an issue (but this also assumes the installation is 100% with all the various bits knowing who else is present and who is the boss). If the battery voltage drops under load (which with only the 1 motor starting is maybe also clutching at straws) I suspect the inverter might still go back to grid.. (?) @Kenneth go with what @Coulomb said..
  7. @KallieDAlebout try to post a picture from ICC that indicates what the system says about the batteries. I know nothing about ICC but looking at this thread you should be able to get something like this: It could help to at least determine if your system knows how many batteries there are?
  8. yup...realised that...and was on my way back here to point out that kenneth should happily ignore my post
  9. I suspect the battery is potentially where the trip up happens. The pylontechs have a 100A (100Ax48V = 4800W) peak limit and the surge of the motor starting (especially if there are already other loads connected or very little PV to help out) probably has the BMS disconnect the battery for protection. The geyser and dishwasher at 4500W are fairly resistive loads and do not have the same inrush current as a motor starting. Do not know if there is an option to have the switch over to grid happen quicker. Hopefully members better versed in axpert will chime in.... I shouldn't play in the PV pool but will point out you need to look at more than the total watts of the panels. You need to check the MPPT max PV volts etc. and then also factor in temperature coefficient for cold mornings. I suggest you post the MPPT spec for the inverter (think there is a sticker/lable on the side of the inverter that gives the info) and include the specs for the solar panels so if better qualified posters come along they can advise you quicker.
  10. been thinking a bit... that PV drop out is likely when the battery state of charge is communicated as full and the PV gets throttled to only cover the loads. If the battery state is indicated as 100% by 14:00ish most days and on those same days after only 13kWh is used the battery state is reported as 13% it would seem like 1/2 the battery is unaccounted for. If this happens more often than not then I would wonder about these things: All battery cables actually connected? Battery size etc. correctly specified in all required monitoring/inverter parameters (simplified example; if part of the system was told there is only a 100Ah battery even when there is a 200Ah battery it will use 90Ah and report that there is only 10% left even though there is more than 50% left). Unfortunately axpert, ICC and emoncms is way outside my wheel hosue so can't help with trouble shooting the exact issue. But keep in mind it is not that difficult to use 24kWh - you do it on average everyday. So if the PV production is lower, and the battery gets used almost exclusively the whole day and night then by the next morning 13% left from 24kWh battery sounds about right.
  11. By my rough calculation from the table posted you consumed about 13kWh during the non PV producing hours. You have about 23kWh battery available if allowing for some communication issue where the batterries default to 80% DOD. Even allowing for losses the battery should make it through the night. The two graphs (and one day table) suggest that somewhere between 13:00-14:25 the PV production all but disappears - unless there was cloud cover all of a sudden this looks a bit strange?. But at least on 28/06 from about 14:45 your PV was barely covering the load so I would think the battery was powering the house from about 15:00 already. Looking at the loads in relation to PV production in the morning also suggest that during this time of the year "night time" is closer to 19 hours than 14. If you have a couple of days in a row like that the batteries may not recharge sufficiently if they are not allowed (or unable) to charge from the grid. I suspect your batteries are possibly not getting fully charged by PV during the day for some reason, or the batteries get called one during the day (maybe peak loads etc) more than you think and then possibly do not get recharged again. The members more well versed in the Axpert/Voltronic setup should be able to point you to some specific settings to check (solar before batteries, back to grid etc.)
  12. Realised I answered a different question ... the 6A charger you have should charge the deep cycle battery you have. You must just check if the rate of charge will be sufficient for your needs - especially when you start adding TV's etc for two hours at a time. Which is why it is always a good idea to walk away... sleep on it and recheck wants/needs (the bluetooth cable will not be used that much) depending what you want/need the "axpert"/voltronic type inverters are worth a good look. I would personally just try to make sure it is an actual voltronic unit and not a full on clone. And since wiring it to the DB came up the whole NRS certified thing can become relevant
  13. Intitial charge current tends to be high depending how discharged/healthy the battery is and will then reduce slowly...and sit at the last very low current bit for a long time. The charge could have started at 6A and then reduced... slight outside possibility .. my builderswarehosue motoquip charger also has a "lower charge" option that you select with a rocker switch (think is about 1/2 of the usual charge current) The CTEK and Victrons should charge roughly any of the lead type battery versions you are likely to encounter. I am going to add another coin in the victron slot... 5 year warranty vs 2 year...
  14. you better hope our glorious leader does not hear about this blasphemy! In all seriousness from my trolling the web a comparative CTEK (MXS 10) is about R1000 more expensive than a Victron (smart 12/15). On paper I think the victrons give much more value at a substantially lower price (higher charge current, blutooth, Li-on mode + everything the CTEK will do?). You may not need all the extras but you get it included in any case. Coffee no matter the battery/weather/eskom state and change from R800... back on topic Note to self...before clicking "pay now" for the inverter...double check the "quantity" column... Looks like you should rather buy an all-in-one inverter solution....anyone who owns a dremmel and orders parts from china should not go near any system that allows modification or addition.... you have been warned...... I'm late! I'm late! For a very important date
  15. not to worry, my dad doesn't know what you did Not that you asked, but I "clocked" my 1.1kW (1.5 HP) pool pump at about 29.9A (233VAC) on "inrush" (first 100ms)... which is possibly a bit quick to bug a multi but when switching to MAX/Min I have seen 25.2A so that peak can last a while (too lazy to switch the pump on/off for an exhaustive data set but I suspect the first second or so should average about 15A).... I would hazard that starting the pump not only says something about the multi but probably also the battery/PV? I played with the idea of using a small Solis grid tied to bring the pool pump bill down (let eskom kick start the pump and then have the solis drive it down the hill) and then realised I can probably achieve the same result with my small multi, ESS and a cron job or two (still studying my way through that part).

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