Electricity wastage that drives you bonkers

[Kory]

Since installing solar and a monitoring system I have become very vigilant of electric usage. Especially as we use so much and I can’t understand why. So during the day we can pull as much as 9kW at a go and I always thought it was the period where the 2 geysers overlap with other stuff. So i noticed the person who irons leave the iron on when they take any form of a break. Only noticed this today when they cannot iron in the ironing room so had to come to patio to iron. They go to the bathroom and I realise the iron is on.

Edited August 29 by Kory

[WannabeSolarSparky]

Yip solar does teach you to use power more efficiently and find those weird energy drains.

[Scorp007]

3 hours ago, WannabeSolarSparky said:

Yip solar does teach you to use power more efficiently and find those weird energy drains.

I stumbled upon a 2016 munic account before monitoring power use. This also 3 yrs before any PV. These days my total account is only 58% what it was 8yrs ago even with my PV only 2500W but I have no wasted PV.

[Bobster.]

19 hours ago, Kory said:

Since installing solar and a monitoring system I have become very vigilant of electric usage. Especially as we use so much and I can’t understand why. So during the day we can pull as much as 9kW at a go and I always thought it was the period where the 2 geysers overlap with other stuff. So i noticed the person who irons leave the iron on when they take any form of a break. Only noticed this today when they cannot iron in the ironing room so had to come to patio to iron. They go to the bathroom and I realise the iron is on.

OK. So there is a theory that a lot of people have grown up with. I am not an engineer so can't tell if it's true or not - though I suspect that there is at least some truth in it.

Think of an old incandescent globe. Well, it takes more power to turn that globe on and get it burning than it does to keep it burning. Now I'm sure this is true for a second at most - the globe does draw a lot more power initially then draws less. So people leave lights on because they use more when you turn them on.

An extreme case of this is a gentleman in an apartment block I used to live in who kept all his lights burning all the time (I'm guessing the one in his bedroom may have been turned off occasionally, but I don't know for sure). *

We tend to value "old wisdom". That theory was stated in a time when the incandescent globe was the only game in town. Your grandadd knew it, so did your dad. Well, it was true then...

Anyway, there's obviously a cross over point. Those globes DID use more power when they started up, but that's momentary. But think it through and there's a cross over at which it becomes more expensive to have the globe on all the time.  But the theory gets extended to other things... if you turn the iron off then turn it back on again, then it's going to use all that power to get hot again. And any half way competent electrician could demonstrate that your fridge drew more power when then motor started up than it did to keep the motor running. So you see? It costs more to turn a thing on than it does to keep it running. 

So part of it is just the "common sense" that has been instilled in people, and who haven't noticed and have been informed by people who haven't noticed, that the world doesn't run on incandescents anymore, that we now have inverter drives in fridges, and that the iron has a thermostat and is turning on and off all by itself anyway. They may believe they are doing the sensible thing because this is what has been drummed into their heads. 

The other side, what you're going through, is quite common once people can or have to monitor their usage. I see this where I live, where people are still converting to pre-paid meters because despite the infamous surcharge that has been introduced, you do still save. Now they have to make sure the meter doesn't run all the way down, and they suddenly become aware of how much they are using. "But I put 10kWh on it last week!"

This is why in the UK the utilities are keen to put timers in showers (on a voluntary basis in homes, and at no charge to the home owner), and give you nice new smart meters with a big colourful display that sits in the living room and makes you constantly aware of how much you're using. They put timers in the showers in a university (I don't know which one). And they split the experiment - some of the timers had a display, some didn't. The ones with the display showed a significant reduction in useage, but the ones with no display still showed a reduction because the users were now aware that usage was being monitored - even though (in both cases) the usage could not be linked to any particular student. Just knowing that a thing is being metered makes us think a bit.

I still have family in the UK. In one house I used to wonder what their bill was like. They had lights on all the time in all their rooms, multiple TVs on (but only one actually being watched) etc etc. Then they got solar because of a deal their council was offering. Now my cousin is, by her admission, a complete power nazi. Very concerned about what time of day the washing machine gets used, checking empty  rooms for lights left on etc. She got that system so she could save money, and by golly she is going to save every penny she can.


* the end of this story is that in said apartment block, the owners used to get billed on a bulk meter for the property. There were individual meters per apartment, but nobody paid those any attention. The bulk bill would then be divided equally across the apartments. But there was unhappiness because of this person who burned their lights all day and night, and also because of another apartment who had a side hustle in baking and whose oven was working nearly all day every day. Those of us who tried to save were finding our bills didn't change very much. So we sat the owners down for a chat. At this point the individual meters were read, and the bulk bill was then pro-rataed according to each apartment's metered consumption (imperfect, but a lot better for those of us trying to save). Very quickly old Mr So-and-So found out empirically that it was cheaper to turn lights on only when needed, and there was a lot of animosity from the bakers because all they were doing was making nice cakes for people and now they had to pay for that.

Edited August 30 by Bobster.
Spellin

[Bobster.]

In my own home I am regarded as a skinflint and a power nazi. This came before I had PV and the prime area of dispute was use of the kettle which went something like this

 

1. Get out of bed, fill the kettle, turn it on. Go back to bed while it's boiling.
2. Fall asleep again.
3. A couple of iterations of 1 and 2
4. Notice that oh it's time to get up, turn the kettle on, get into the shower.
5. Turn the kettle on, get dressed
6. Turn the kettle on, feed the dog
7. Turn the kettle on then go do your hair, have a shave, put on your make up or whatever
8. Turn the kettle on, put on your shoes
9. Make two cups of coffee.

This used to drive me mad. I was told that it's only a few rands a month. I said well firstly, they are my rands. Secondly, that's not really the point. The point is that this scenario is playing out in millions of homes across the world. If you could get it into people's heads that all they need to do is heat just enough water and heat it once, think how much power that would save and what the reduction in emissions would be. 

[Bobster.]

The smart, industrious, thoughful Mbali Ntuli (I think a great loss to party politics in this country) is now campainging for schools to teach simple money management, including (but not limited to) how to keep your household bills down. People don't instinctively understand this stuff. 

[HendrikBigChief]

13 minutes ago, Bobster. said:

The smart, industrious, thoughful Mbali Ntuli (I think a great loss to party politics in this country) is now campainging for schools to teach simple money management, including (but not limited to) how to keep your household bills down. People don't instinctively understand this stuff. 

Teaching it won't make much of a difference. It is human nature to spend all your money as fast as possible. Very few can resist the temptation. And this is regardless of how much money you make.

Edited August 30 by HendrikBigChief

[Bobster.]

Just now, HendrikBigChief said:

Teaching it won't make much of a difference. It is human nature to spend all your money as fast as possible. Very few can resist the temptation. And this is regardless to how much money you make.

Maybe. But we're at least half way agreeing. People don't just sommer know that if you start disciplining yourself a bit then you can save on your household bills. If you save that you can have a better DSTV option or you can pay a little more into the bond each month - which does wonderful things. 

What I find interesting, as I related at some length above, is that once we have to start watching numbers move on a meter, or are even just made aware that whatever it is is being used is metered, our behaviour changes.

What we're reading in this thread is that we can change our ways.
 

[Paulcupine]

2 hours ago, Bobster. said:

In my own home I am regarded as a skinflint and a power nazi. This came before I had PV and the prime area of dispute was use of the kettle which went something like this

 

1. Get out of bed, fill the kettle, turn it on. Go back to bed while it's boiling.
2. Fall asleep again.
3. A couple of iterations of 1 and 2
4. Notice that oh it's time to get up, turn the kettle on, get into the shower.
5. Turn the kettle on, get dressed
6. Turn the kettle on, feed the dog
7. Turn the kettle on then go do your hair, have a shave, put on your make up or whatever
8. Turn the kettle on, put on your shoes
9. Make two cups of coffee.

This used to drive me mad. I was told that it's only a few rands a month. I said well firstly, they are my rands. Secondly, that's not really the point. The point is that this scenario is playing out in millions of homes across the world. If you could get it into people's heads that all they need to do is heat just enough water and heat it once, think how much power that would save and what the reduction in emissions would be. 

It wasn't quite as bad in our house but the filling of a 2L kettle everytime to make one cup of coffee made me go out and buy a 1L camping kettle.  It also has a smaller element, so now nobody is willing to wait for it if it is full.  Problem solved, and the cleaner got the old one for free.

[Scorp007]

3 hours ago, HendrikBigChief said:

Teaching it won't make much of a difference. It is human nature to spend all your money as fast as possible. Very few can resist the temptation. And this is regardless of how much money you make.

Solar has in a way made a lot more people think about ROI. 

One thing we have to learn is to think that of the money we earn we don't have to spend it ALL. A tiny bit is yours and you can invest it to grow. This bit need not to be hard work. Time thus becomes your friend. 

 

[Kory]

4 hours ago, Paulcupine said:

It wasn't quite as bad in our house but the filling of a 2L kettle everytime to make one cup of coffee made me go out and buy a 1L camping kettle.  It also has a smaller element, so now nobody is willing to wait for it if it is full.  Problem solved, and the cleaner got the old one for free.

We also have this version and the culprits are different. 

[Vaal]

When people b&m about their high high electricity account but if you walk in the house, the kettle is 75% full of hot water, the geyser is set to 75°C and every light is on in the house.

If you cannot save R1, how can you save R1000? To save is a mindset. 

[Scorp007]

14 minutes ago, Vaal said:

When people b&m about their high high electricity account but if you walk in the house, the kettle is 75% full of hot water, the geyser is set to 75°C and every light is on in the house.

If you cannot save R1, how can you save R1000? To save is a mindset. 

The worst for me if you see a single parent battling. They don't teech their kids to switch off lights. Now I have explained to them how much power is wasted as their 2 bedroom house still have 50W down lights and every light is on. When they all visit me and we all sit outside and all the lights are left ON I wish there was an Q&A for how to. What is worst the parent was brought up to switch lights on when they enter a room even during peak sunshine. There is always never enough light and they wish normal lights were even brighter. 

Never will they try and save that R1 that can be R10 when the kids are adults. 

Habits won't be broken unless there is the WILL. 

[display_Name]

I'm reading this and my only take is thinking... am I the only person that doesn't iron any more?

But more the the point... the single best part of getting my inverter is that I now understand my consumption intimately.

Edited September 3 by display_Name

[HendrikBigChief]

3 minutes ago, display_Name said:

I'm reading this and my only take is thinking... am I the only person that doesn't iron any more?

But more the the point... the single best part of getting my inverter is that I now understand my consumption intimately.

Join the club, lent my iron and ironing board to the neighbors a while ago, they never gave it back, so no ironing happening at my house.

[Bobster.]

1 hour ago, display_Name said:

I'm reading this and my only take is thinking... am I the only person that doesn't iron any more?

We have certainly cut back. EG my socks and underwear are now strictly no-iron.