I'm sharing this with the larger Solar community because it's about education. Helping to spread awareness even for the DIY guy to know what is required & if you hire someone to install for you that you have an idea of the requirements of how it should look & how it totally should not look. 

I was asked to assist in an audit of a site that had a long list of issues that was making the owner a bit concerned. I won't go through an extensive detailed list of non compliance issues, this is a snap shot summary: 

1) DC battery cables not the same length, batteries discharge & charge at different rates. 

2) The use of AC isolators on the PV strings 6 odd strings if I remember correctly. 

3) Surge protectors used on the PV Array combiner  box but wired up incorrectly. 

4) The plant is capable of 1200A discharge draw from the Batteries but 160A fuses used & the same limit programmed into the inverter as a discharge limit.

5) Powering the Circuits directly into the main DB box. No Sub DB for Essential Circuits. No Essential & Non essential spilt. 

6) No Earth spike nor standard approved mounting system used. They drilled holes into the solar panel frame & used flat bar to attach the panels to each other. 

7) DC and AC wiring intermixed at multiple points in the trunking even though a dual channel trunking system used. 

This is a small list of non compliance that we found on face value. We found and encountered more as we had to investigate further. 

Here are a few pics, it will probably open up a whole lot of discussion & that is the point of this post, to discuss & learn & get to a better understanding together. 

But all in all this plant was valued at +-R750k odd & I would hate this type of installation to be replicated. The original installer was invited to the initial inspection to which he did not make the appointment. 

I've unfortunately gone through similar installation with headaches and my 2-cents for all of us on the forum would be that whatever cost the installer charges he/she gets 80% and balance upon an independent certification by another installer or certified guy. The risk and loses are just to high to pay someone full cost and be saddled with such issues as:

* Use of electrical cable instead of dc cables

* Use of wrong size cables

* Inadequate system protection (on PV, DC & Battery disconnects)...

If they do not show up on the day of an appointment with an independent installer, they forfeit the balance. That said, get the quote first before bringing this condition, otherwise you will be saddled with add-on's that make sure that the 80% is still good enough for them to do a shoddy job and not come back anyway.

Very well said, this will definitely deter a dodgey outfit very quickly. 

Wow @Steve87 that is quite shocking (pun unintended). Yes, we have some installers with very "interesting" ways of doing things, and we need to share more of this, because a lot of it is due to ignorance of the installer, but there is also a certain amount of callousness amongst some installers. These guys just give the industry a bad name. Thanks for sharing, it's educational and will assist everyone.

Whilst we are on the subject of poor installers, I have a few gripes of my own:

I commissioned and paid for an urgent solar installation at a family member's home (which was quite far away), and I made sure that I ordered more than enough solar cabling, GP wire, earth wire and battery cabling, thinking that due to the urgency, I would rather have too much on site than too little, and I can always re-use it for something else. There were also around 12 extra Renusol clamps (I had to order more due to the installer's poor planning and incompetence) and a fair amount of aluminium profile left over. I never saw any of the excess cabling, nor the mounting kit, because the installer snarfed them all, and I wasn't around to challenge him 😦 I know that the last bit is my own fault, I should have been there to supervise, but I was over 1000Km away.

I think that it is most unprofessional for an installer to help themselves to the excess mounting kit and wire 😡 I paid for it, and if he wanted it, the least that he could have done was ask. I will never, ever recommend him to anyone, and if I ever get called for a reference, I will make sure that I let everyone know what a dishonest thief he is.

And it's not only the solar industry. I paid for the installation of two aluminium Tornado turbines on my garage roof, and I also ordered and paid extra for two sheets of aluminium to marry the turbine with the IBR roof, this being what the saleslady telephonicly recommended that I needed. The installers only used a small portion of the first aluminium sheet for both turbines, and when they were finished they had the audacity to put the leftover sheeting, as well as the untouched second sheet back into their van. I was astounded, and told them to fetch and place it in my garage, because it was mine and I had paid for it! Once again, installers helping themselves to kit that isn't theirs.

Seeing this confirms a suspicion of mine that at least half of SA's electrical wiring is held together with insulation tape... astounding!

This was harrowing indeed to discover. Ignorance is one thing & that it the main reason I was really more than comfortable for this installer to be part of the audit. I am in no way perfect with the way I install but I think, we can all learn something new the more we rub shoulders with each other. 

The scary part of this is that subsequent to the installer been given the original findings report his reply has been that he thinks anyone can send a spike or two into the ground by this does nothing to protect from a lightning strike 😁😂

Let me also add that this installer comes from an electrician background. There was not even a transfer switch installed at this site. This is a pic of what was his attempt at a bypass...

I can live with ignorance & we can all learn something, but please what I cannot handle is someone taking on such a massive job & not even open up the required regulations on how to safely do it. Then when found lacking cannot even have the dignity to acknowledge his shortcomings. Rather continue arguing how he did it correctly & added anti theft devices to the panels etc. I am really disgusted more of his attitude towards the findings. I also stayed objective in my report. I did not express my opinion but I stated every fact according to reference of the SANS 10142. 

We need to clean up our Industry & quickly. As much as I hate too much red tape, I must admit the City of Cape Town has put together a pretty solid standard & have enforced it well. It's a very controversial statement to make but it prevents a mess like this taking place. The PV Green Card is one such platform & I think we need more. 

The more I look at the pics of this the more my blood boils. 

There were 6 X Kodak OG10.0s in a 3 phase config 2 per phase with the 160A Keto Fuse on the batteries. That is a 1200A capable capacity on the DC side with a 160A fuse fitted.

I did a load test, & the peak loads did not exceed 7.5kW. Really really Harrowing!!! 

That is quite the find ! 

A quick one to touch on, do the essential and non essential circuits need to be split into different DB's ? 

I.e what is fed from the inverter need to be in a seperate DB ? 

Is there a reg number in SANS 10142-1 ? 

And what exactly is up with those panel rails? Does that mean some panels came flying off what looks like a double story roof? 😱

It is very sad, there are a ton of guys, some of whom are even well recommended who are missing a ton of critical steps to do safe installations.

You can end up with an installation that looks very neat and up to code on the surface but has serious safety concerns underlying.

And the way the solar panels have been mounted.... 🤢

@ dylboy

The db sections can be in one panel, but they need to be clearly seperated and marked.

Edited August 20, 20224 yr by Cole

@Dylboy SANS 10142-1-2 Anex D...

Shows example diagrams of Installations and they are separate DBs. However, many might have a more clear exact code description. 

@Colethis was one such Installation. On face value looked a good & neat install. Deep down it was riddled with issues. One such issue was the 3 X 20kW FreedomWon Lite 20/16 batteries in parallel. For those that are not familiar, the FreedomWon has a colour coded SoC LED on the front to indicate it's SoC. The 3 batteries quite often had different LED colours & this concerned the owner. 

On my site visit I connected a 2.5kW load (kettle) & had very different DC amp readings. Dead giveaway the cable lengths were not equal. 30A, 15A & 5A respectively. Means the 30A battery was constantly getting discharged and charged first. Hence the different LED colours. 

I have uploaded the Solar PV Green Card Installation guidelines. The document is quite comprehensive & maybe worth a read if you have spare time.  

It's in the downloads section.

Edited August 20, 20224 yr by Steve87

15 hours ago, jumper said:

And what exactly is up with those panel rails? Does that mean some panels came flying off what looks like a double story roof? 

No, panels did not come unstuck. There was a shattered panel spotted and then the owner made a decision to remove and store all of them until a proper re-install could be done. The shattered panel most definitely makes for an unsafe situation. The + and - of the panels never come into contact with each other when the panel is in good order. However, when a panel is shattered it could break this isolation and especially with the presence of water to seep through the cracks in the panel adding the fact that the panels are not earthed. This all added up to a conservatively safe decision made. Each string in this array is at +-400V dc. 

Also to clarify a statement that was made on the earth spike and its use. A direct lightning hit has nothing that can stop that event from happening. There is an entry and an exit route the lightning will take. They can be metres apart in location. Sometimes 2 panels will be toast from a single hit and they can be 20 metres apart. This is lot of energy and these two areas will sustain a lot of damage. Those panels are for the dust bin. Where does the Earth spike fit into this equation?? It provides a safe passage for that energy to be dissipated into the ground and not to linger into other places namely your home and the inverter setup. Added to this there is Surge protectors that live in the PV Combiner Box and also PV fuses. This system works as links in a chain to defend against that Lightning event not causing further damage to the inside where your Solar equipment is housed, namely the inverter and other equipment. What is involved to Earth an Array. Each panel is framed in anodised alluminium which is a poor conductor. The annodised layer prevents the panels from being a conductor. It helps to resist against nicks and scratches. Aluminium by nature is a good conductor. So one needs to break through the annodised layer to ensure that the entire Array is on contact with each other. Small earth plates are placed in between each U bracket that breaks through the annodised layer and ties the frames to each other. So the Earthing is easy in this case because you can run a single Earth wire to the 1st or last panel and this is then in contact with the entire Array. The entire Array is Earthed. In the case review above, the no approved mounting method means a wire would have to be run to each individual panel. This would require a cable length longer than 50m requiring the cable to be housed in Galvanized channel. 

You can now see how the costs escalate due to a poor first attempt at an installation. 

The Exterior Earth Spike, The Surge protectors and the fuses all contribute to limiting that lightning strike to your roof and the PV Array and not your equipment connected down route. 

 

 

Edited August 21, 20224 yr by Steve87

I blame the end user, that's what you get when you look for the cheapest fly by night quote. And the OP paid R750 000 - just wow. I would agree with the City of Cape Town Rules and Regs - they are excellent.

@PumbaI think that's a bit harsh, you can't assume that the cheapest quotation was taken. This is about helping that this doesn't repeat in the future. Many installations sit with this exact issue. A lot of ppl wouldnt care less.

The point of the matter doesn't include price. You can pay a lot & still end up with this mess. Regulation is needed, checking and inspection. Not just a quick main AC box CoC. The master electricians need to be trained & qualified accordingly to uphold these standards otherwise they mean nothing. 

However, any warranty claim will usually involve 3 aspects, presentation of the CoC, a pic of the installation and the presence of Surge protectors. No CoC provided after this installation means all the equipment is not covered under the OEM warranty. 

Edited August 21, 20224 yr by Steve87

On 2022/08/20 at 1:03 PM, Steve87 said:

Give the guy a break, he was trying the aesthetic look
Angling towards the roof split 🤣

Hi @Steve87 Re: Separate/Splitting AC DBs. I have attached an article about the subject. 

 

Splitting the AC DB.pdf

@ChunksThis document is Gold!!! & must be placed in the downloads section. It would appear that you are most correct, the neutrals are the most important to separate. I have made this exact mistake at some Installations that I have had to clean up & fix up due to non compliance. In essence this can fry appliances & I preach this same message to as many ppl as I can find. I made this exact mistake on this very site & it cost a fridge, kettle & a PC. 

This is the massive danger in mixing Eskom/ Municipal power & an alternative Power source like Solar. Let's face it, Neutral Bus bars in a DB are so poorly marked. The Lives are easy to track, however, Neutrals are the biggest trap of mixing power sources. I think that labeling the Box as having an alternative sources of power is not enough. The Neutrals need labelling also. I guess that is not possible because the normal average DB is so confined it's not possible. 

The DB spilt is still for me a much safer endeavour & I always say one should work as if a complete novice will come in after the work & not mix things up with the neutrals. 

Thank you for this reference document above it is really Gold !!!! @Chunkswhat a valuable first post!!! Welcome to the forum 🤠

Thanks @Steve87. I also prefer to physically split the DBs.

Agree, It is a great article.
 

And as you mentioned above, the forum is  “about education”, so I thought I should share it.