1 hour ago, Steve87 said:

Hi @Lee2this is compliant & many ppl do this to great effect. The most important thing is that changeover switch & get a CoC with this. Then you have some piece of mind. 

Is there any chance you have any photos of such a setup [inverters connected to the changeover via these blue plugs you see used with generators] that you could share as a reference?

 

Edited September 18, 20223 yr by Lee2

Unfortunately, I have not installed any installation with the blue plug, however, in practise this is just a glorified plug point sometimes used in caravan parks. The only difference being in that it has nice thick AC wiring on the inside that can handle the said Amperage for its rating. This is then connects to the Changeover switch & it's really the Changeover switch that makes all the difference in terms of safety & compliance. That switch has two inputs & one output. So you can select between only 1 power source at a time. It will give you one source or the other but never both. 

Here is a few pics I have from some installations. 

Amazing thank you! Where does one get those auto-changeovers that are din-mounted from? Also what is Local Switch? Is that just overload protection for the EL? I also didn't know one could run a CBI Astute for the geyser without overload protection? 

Hi Guys

I am in the same boat as h4ns3n

I will wall mount the inverter and battery, do all trunking, run the new AC cables back to the DB, Config the inverter, do the DC battery side cabling.

I need a sparky for the AC side ,  put 2 plug circuits and all light circuits onto the inverter, and rest stay on Eskom.

I have no expectation for them to config the inverter, or take any responsibility for the inverter/battery warranty.

I just want the AC side to be correctly wired and compliant.

I expect be charged for any parts they use for this, and their time, which should be 2 - 4 hours.

If there are complications then I am happy to pay more for the hours they work.

Surely a blanket R10K type quote for  a "solar install" isn't applicable for this job? 

Edited September 20, 20223 yr by Brendonvdh

The problem is the installers prefer working for a super rich person installing a system worth hundreds of k where they walking away with super profits and they just not interested in working for you. When the global energy crisis calms down and the SA ultra rich all have systems, then prices will decrease. Until then it is bad timing

31 minutes ago, Lee2 said:

The problem is the installers prefer working for a super rich person installing a system worth hundreds of k where they walking away with super profits and they just not interested in working for you. When the global energy crisis calms down and the SA ultra rich all have systems, then prices will decrease. Until then it is bad timing

Yes I agree with this. 

There must be plenty general sparky's around that aren't "solar installers" that will happily do this job and charge the normal time and materials.

On 2022/09/19 at 2:28 PM, Lee2 said:

I also didn't know one could run a CBI Astute for the geyser without overload protection? 

Hi Lee the Astute still need overload protection, It is basically just a fancy wifi timer that measures load connected through it. I still have my normal geyser circuit breakers upstream from the astute.

On 2022/09/20 at 2:19 PM, Lee2 said:

The problem is the installers prefer working for a super rich person installing a system worth hundreds of k where they walking away with super profits and they just not interested in working for you. When the global energy crisis calms down and the SA ultra rich all have systems, then prices will decrease. Until then it is bad timing

South Africa's energy crisis has nothing to do with the global energy crisis. Unlike Europe we have more than 200 years of coal reserves. The crisis here is self-inflicted by poor decion-making and governance.

Agree, when load-shedding eases, which is just a matter of time, then solar installer rates will converge to that of electrician rates.

Their current rates are reflective of the high demand. What will also drive rates lower is the many non-solar electricians are furiously reading/learning on how to install inverters. Hence supply of these skills is bound to increase.

7 hours ago, Stochastic said:

South Africa's energy crisis has nothing to do with the global energy crisis. Unlike Europe we have more than 200 years of coal reserves. The crisis here is self-inflicted by poor decion-making and governance.

Agree, when load-shedding eases, which is just a matter of time, then solar installer rates will converge to that of electrician rates.

Their current rates are reflective of the high demand. What will also drive rates lower is the many non-solar electricians are furiously reading/learning on how to install inverters. Hence supply of these skills is bound to increase.

There is now massive additional global demand for the same alternative energy products that we want pushing up prices. 

Edited September 30, 20223 yr by Lee2

18 minutes ago, Lee2 said:

There is now massive additional global demand for the same alternative energy products that we want pushing up prices. 

I think that will push up the price of components and/or increase waiting times. Installation charges will be driven by local factors.

A solar installation with panels is a labor intensive job, the notion that demand will bring down install costs is not accurate. Lifting 20 panels onto a roof is not child's play. I fail to see how these kind of installs will drop over time in price. Unless people are happy to pay fly by nights to reduce costs.

20 hours ago, Treschen said:

A solar installation with panels is a labor intensive job, the notion that demand will bring down install costs is not accurate. Lifting 20 panels onto a roof is not child's play. I fail to see how these kind of installs will drop over time in price. Unless people are happy to pay fly by nights to reduce costs.

That’s what most people who speak this narrative don’t understand. Have a look at this 16kw Deye with 3 Hubble AM2s that was done cheaply. 
 

6mm AC cabling on a 16k inverter. 
25mm battery cable with a 125A fuse.

Inverter set at 250A charge and discharge from the batteries which eventually destroyed the fuses

PV wires in the roof joined as if it was cotton  MC4s cut off and wired twisted and insulated 

Go cheap if you want. Just don’t complain afterwards  

 

 

@Leshengive this man a Bells Whiskey!!! Very well summed up. What a mess on the above install 😓

39 minutes ago, Leshen said:

That’s what most people who speak this narrative don’t understand. Have a look at this 16kw Deye with 3 Hubble AM2s that was done cheaply. 
 

6mm AC cabling on a 16k inverter. 
25mm battery cable with a 125A fuse.

Inverter set at 250A charge and discharge from the batteries which eventually destroyed the fuses

PV wires in the roof joined as if it was cotton  MC4s cut off and wired twisted and insulated 

Go cheap if you want. Just don’t complain afterwards  

 

 

Exactly my point, this is where you compromise your own safety and your family to save a few bucks. Those skinny DC and AC cables on a 16kw unit makes me cringe. Sad to say we have seen our fair share of these types of installs floating around

Even seen Facebook posts screaming non compliance yet they are selling solutions.

On 2022/10/01 at 8:55 AM, Leshen said:

That’s what most people who speak this narrative don’t understand. Have a look at this 16kw Deye with 3 Hubble AM2s that was done cheaply. 
 

6mm AC cabling on a 16k inverter. 
25mm battery cable with a 125A fuse.

Inverter set at 250A charge and discharge from the batteries which eventually destroyed the fuses

PV wires in the roof joined as if it was cotton  MC4s cut off and wired twisted and insulated 

Go cheap if you want. Just don’t complain afterwards  

 

@Leshen I appreciate your post above. And more importantly I appreciate someone of your repute commenting on this thread. 

In my journey from newb to slightly more informed I have come across your name from other online forums and you come highly recommended by many. 

With that said though, you will agree there is often no direct correlation between quality and price. You often get greedy installers who don't pay their staff well or employ staff with inferior skills and pay them peanuts who will produce the above quality of work, but the entrepreneur in the business will charge the customer a premium fee.

We, the uninformed and unskilled customer, have no guarantee of quality workmanship. That's just the way it is. 

Edited October 5, 20223 yr by h4ns3n

22 minutes ago, h4ns3n said:

With that said though, you will agree there is often no direct correlation between quality and price. You often get greedy installers who don't pay their staff well or employ staff with inferior skills and pay them peanuts who will produce the above quality of work, but the entrepreneur in the business will charge the customer a premium fee.

We, the uninformed and unskilled customer, have no guarantee of quality workmanship. That's just the way it is. 

This is true. As an article I recently read put it 'there is little in the way of regulatory authorities or a sunny ombudsperson ensuring we’re not all buying the equivalent of skorokoros with a Ferrari badge glued on to the bonnet.'

The thing to do is to do the research first before you buy anything. Ask questions, get references, do your own power audit to get a rough idea of what your consumption is and to see where you can make some quick saves. Understand (for example) what is meant by a "5kw" system (IE that it can back up about 22A). Once you've done that, you can make better informed decisions. 

Here's an article that describes one non-technical person's journey. It's quite good at explaining some of the things that may not automatically occur to a purchaser, and that you don't get from adverts on social media.

Edited October 5, 20223 yr by Bobster.

8 minutes ago, Bobster. said:

This is true. As an article I recently read put it 'there is little in the way of regulatory authorities or a sunny ombudsperson ensuring we’re not all buying the equivalent of skorokoros with a Ferrari badge glued on to the bonnet.'

The thing to do is to do the research first before you buy anything. Ask questions, get references, do your own power audit to get a rough idea of what your consumption is and to see where you can make some quick saves. Understand (for example) what is meant by a "5kw" system (IE that it can back up about 22A). Once you've done that, you can make better informed decisions. 

Here's an article that describes one non-technical person's journey. It's quite good at explaining some of the things that may not automatically occur to a purchaser, and that you don't get from adverts on social media.

It is an excellent article and inspired my decision recently. I was looking at a simple backup kit until I read that article. I've since decided to go with slightly higher quality components in my setup. 

5kw Deye, 5kwh Shoto, 10 X 470W JA panels. Installed by a reputable installer with CoC and SSEG registration for R110k.

With an average of 23kwh per day over the past 4 months, I'm comfortable this will see to my needs for now.

22 hours ago, h4ns3n said:

5kw Deye, 5kwh Shoto, 10 X 470W JA panels. Installed by a reputable installer with CoC and SSEG registration for R110k.

I have gone the opposite route. I cant afford 100K and couldn't justify a R45K+ 5kW system, so went with a basic 12v backup system for R10K

1 hubble s-120 12v battery and 700w Must hybrid inverter https://www.solarwaysuppliers.co.za/product/must-1-2kva-solar-portable-inverter/

DIY install, I kept it separate from the DB. Connected TVs, Internet stuff and lights only.

I ran extension cords from the inverter through the roof to our 2 x TVs.. Luckily I have open conduits to get the extension wires down to the TV  so its all neat.

Max load I have seen is 400W, lasts through 2.5 hours load shedding no problem. 

This cheap system works for us. The little inverter is actually very impressive for the price. Same functionality of the larger inverters.

Will add a couple 160W panels next month just in case eskom dies. 

 

1 hour ago, Brendonvdh said:

I have gone the opposite route. I cant afford 100K and couldn't justify a R45K+ 5kW system, so went with a basic 12v backup system for R10K

1 hubble s-120 12v battery and 700w Must hybrid inverter https://www.solarwaysuppliers.co.za/product/must-1-2kva-solar-portable-inverter/

DIY install, I kept it separate from the DB. Connected TVs, Internet stuff and lights only.

I ran extension cords from the inverter through the roof to our 2 x TVs.. Luckily I have open conduits to get the extension wires down to the TV  so its all neat.

Max load I have seen is 400W, lasts through 2.5 hours load shedding no problem. 

This cheap system works for us. The little inverter is actually very impressive for the price. Same functionality of the larger inverters.

Will add a couple 160W panels next month just in case eskom dies. 

 

How much did this set up cost? The link has it out of stock.

37 minutes ago, MKRandburg said:

How much did this set up cost? The link has it out of stock.

R11K in total

I bought the inverter from geewiz for R2,549.00 - they also out of stock and the price has gone up.

https://www.geewiz.co.za/load-shedding-solutions/188209-crystal-hybrid-1200va-720w-inverter-battery-charger-ups-intelligent-fan-modified-sine-wave-with-50a-pwm-solar-controller.html

Its branded Crystal but is the same inverter. I think there are other online sellers who have it in stock.

I also got the battery from geewiz for R7200 - also gone up now.

I got 16mm battery cables and inline fuse (50A) from outdoor warehouse, and extension leads from takealot.

Edited October 6, 20223 yr by Brendonvdh

On 2022/10/06 at 11:25 AM, Brendonvdh said:

I have gone the opposite route. I can't afford 100K and couldn't justify a R45K+ 5kW system, so went with a basic 12v backup system for R10K

1 hubble s-120 12v battery and 700w Must hybrid inverter https://www.solarwaysuppliers.co.za/product/must-1-2kva-solar-portable-inverter/

DIY install, I kept it separate from the DB. Connected TVs, Internet stuff and lights only.

I ran extension cords from the inverter through the roof to our 2 x TVs.. Luckily I have open conduits to get the extension wires down to the TV  so its all neat.

Max load I have seen is 400W, lasts through 2.5 hours load shedding no problem. 

This cheap system works for us. The little inverter is actually very impressive for the price. Same functionality of the larger inverters.

Will add a couple 160W panels next month just in case eskom dies. 

 

It's a great solution you have there. I should have done the same but I wanted to start building capacity to eventually be free of this nightmare and be totally non reliant on CoCT or Eskom.

In the coming months I'll add probably add another 5kw battery and another 6 415W panels to reach my max of 6500W. 

All the best with your solution, It's a good start. 

Just to give some feedback 

I contacted a local recommended electrician to get my inverter connected to my DB

Took him about 2 hours , included a changeover switch and the wiring, inverter is next to the DB so not much wire needed

Just connected my 3 light circuits, so it was fairly straightforward.

He charged me R1950. 

I bought my Sunsynk, Hubble AM2 and 10 x JA panels myself, but then the guy who said he will do the installation informed me that he doesn't install equipment which he didn't buy himself. I decided stuff him, I'll do it myself. My installation would have cost me about R40k.

I must say if I got R1 per step climbing up and down a ladder I would have got close to the R40k back. But I did it myself and alone, except for the CoC. It is best to educate yourself then at least you can ask the right questions and see where the installer screws up. 

Strange that some people sitting in a office and earn a good salary, wants a perfect installation but wants to pay peanuts. You get what you pay for - mosr if the time. LoL

On 2022/11/02 at 8:31 AM, Brendonvdh said:

Just to give some feedback 

I contacted a local recommended electrician to get my inverter connected to my DB

Took him about 2 hours , included a changeover switch and the wiring, inverter is next to the DB so not much wire needed

Just connected my 3 light circuits, so it was fairly straightforward.

He charged me R1950. 

Glad to hear it is possible, looking for someone like that in Cape Town/Bellville area.

I came across Elektronites SA Pty Ltd and they installed the equipment.

8kW Sunsynk inverter, 2 Sunsynk batteries and 16 x 550W Canadian panels. I had bought the stuff online at Lite-Glo.

The guys took about 6 hours to finish.